* Posts by Loyal Commenter

5761 publicly visible posts • joined 20 Jul 2010

Bruce Schneier: You want real IoT security? Have Uncle Sam start putting boots to asses

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Re: 6 years (and counting) for a fridge

It's not the old Freon anymore. The stuff is supposedly environmentally safe.. and expensive. Horribly expensive.

Unless your 'new' fridge was manufactured before the mid '90s, it won't have contained CFCs. My understanding is that the freon most commonly in use nowadays is 1,1,1,2-terachloroethane, which is prety cheap stuff, probably less than £10 to fill a fridge. I've also seen fridges with cyclopentane in them, which is also dirt-cheap, but flammable.

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Re: 6 years (and counting) for a fridge

£300 for a re-gas. Fucking hell what sort of freon are they using? Unobtainium?

My hoard of obsolete hardware might be useful… one day

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Re: Power adaptors are always useful

If the gizmo says 12v / 1A , and your psu says 12v / 5A - it wont blow it up

But if the label on the psu, written in 1pt flyspec font actually says 19V 1A, but it has the plug on the lead that fits the gizmo and you plug it in in error, it probably will blow up the gizmo, and possibly the psu as well.

The one that has annoyed me recently is the power supplies that come with cheap home dehumidifiers. They seem to put out an unusual voltage (IIRC 13V) and also have a plug that isn't the same size or shape as any other standard power supply (a rectangular thing with two 'female' pins and a notch in the side) and seem to burn out after a year, with nowhere you can get a replacement...

Data flows post-Brexit: 'Leave it to government to make sure you've got a smooth run in.' Er, OK

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Joke

Re: There really is no hope

After the warm summer and sudden cold snap in the last few weeks, we've had quite a few mice come into our home. Sadly, the only real solution to this is to use traps.

I realise now that my partner was only half joking last night when she suggested that rather than dispose of the bodies, I should be freezing them so we have something to eat after brexit. I could be setting up a proud all-British enterprise in the spirit of CMOT Dibbler selling mouse-onna-stick.

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It's that typical thing of sending thick people to very expensive schools. It doesn't produce geniuses, it just produces very confident idiots.

It's interesting you should say this. I was 'fortunate' enough to be schooled at a reasonably expensive school (not a very expensive one, mind), largely for the better quality of teaching. Having previously experienced the teaching quality at the local comprehensive, I can confirm that this was undoubtedly of better quality.

However, there was an atmosphere even here whereby achievement was measured not by academic success, but by who you were, and how well you did on the sports field. For instance, the head boy in my year just happened (purely by chance I'm sure) to be the son of the school's bursar (which is a posh word for accountant). Even in a relatively unknown private school, there was a culture of preference towards 'breeding' - in other words the posh boys got away with whatever they liked and were handed privilege on a plate.

At the time, I thought I was lucky to get a better quality of education than the masses, but in hindsight, the whole experience really just illustrates how private schooling feeds social division. The money pumped into such schools would instead be much better spent on giving the same level of education to all, so that those with the greatest ability get the support they need to achieve to their potential, instead of, as stated above, ending up with more very confident idiots.

Now Europe wants a four-million-quid AI-powered lie detector at border checkpoints

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Re: Yeah sure

"Avrio is manana without a sense of urgency"

And Metavrio is the day after that...

Nikola Tesla's greatest challenge: He could measure electricity but not stupidity

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Re: Noted scientists

Go here to vote on the new £50 note.

https://app.keysurvey.co.uk/f/1348443/10fc/

I've gone with Dorothy Hodgkin, the Nobel prize winning developer of x-ray protein crystallography. Both ebcuase she was very smart, and because women are sadly underrepresented on bank notes.

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Re: The name 'Tesla' has been hijacked

When you ask someone what a Tesla is unless they are an old skool Electrical Engineer they might say 'oh, that's a funny car that runs on batteries'.

I'd go with something you shouldn't go near with your keys in your pocket, unless you want to be stuck to whatever is causing it.

As a unit of measurement, the scale is a bit off of most practical uses.

US Republicans bash UK for tech tax plan

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Re: "Representative Kevin Brady (R-TX), chairman of the influential House Ways and Means Committee"

That said, I was wrong in my expectations as to votes twice in 2016.

You forgot to take into account the fact that, since you are commenting on a story on a tech news site, you are probably significantly "smarter than the average bear", whilst, by definition, 50% of voters are dumber than average.

You made the mistake of thinking that others would follow the same logic as yourself, rather than swallowing whatever bullshit was piped into their faces. Like some sort of reverse Dunning-Kruger effect, where you don't realise how stupid everyone else is.

This one weird trick turns your Google Home Hub into a doorstop

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The most significant words in this article:

without any authentication.

Quite frankly, I should think that's a sackable offence for at least one person at Google.

Bomb squad descends on suspicious package to find something much more dangerous – a Journey cassette

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Re: Harmless

I'd guess that most cars on the road have a tape player.

Not any cars made this century. I'd be surprised to even see a CD player in anything made in the last couple of years.

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Re: Escalation

Or Station's most bodacious creation, the good robot us-es?

AI can predict the structure of chemical compounds thousands of times faster than quantum chemistry

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I can remember Glaxo getting the first 750 MHz machine in the UK

If that machine was based in Stevenage, I may have actually used it, in around '99 or so, back when they were GlaxoWellcome, but not yet merged with Smithkline Beecham to form GSK.

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When I was a student, I remember seeing a number of 2 pence coins placed edge to edge suspended in mid-air following the field lines of an NMR spectrometer. It gives you an appreciation of the field strengths involved, especially considering that 2p coins are not ferromagnetic..

Powering down (and restarting) the magnets on those things is not a trivial task, especially when you consider that (at the time at least), they were cooled with liquid helium (at -269°C), which itself was surrounded with liquid nitrogen (at -196°C). Getting those things up to room temperature so that foreign objects can be accessed and removed, and then cooling them back down again is a serious undertaking.

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Admittedly, it is the best part of two decades since I've used an NMR machine. IIRC, 13C spectra are weak (due to low isotope abundance) and messy (due to lots of coupling in anything but the simpelst compounds), so require much higher fields to get a clean spectrum. At the time, the cutting-edge machines ran at about 400MHz (with field strengths of around 10T), and the one in use at my Uni was 100Mhz. I suspect the frequencies (and corresponding field strengths) have gone up since then towards the 1GHz range.

You're absolutely right about the 2D spectra - I'd totally forgotten that deuterium isn't spin-neutral! If my memory serves me correctly, the peak from trace amounts of un-deuterated solvent at the machine's native frequency was used as the reference point, as the solvents were usually 99+% deuterated, not 100%.

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Groups of atoms oscillate at a specific frequencies, providing a tell-tale sign of the number and location of electrons each contains.

This is not strictly true; NMR works by flipping the nuclear spin on unpaired protons in the atomic nucleus (hence the 'N' for 'nuclear' in 'NMR' - which is also why the same technology used in the medical field is called 'MRI', because the 'N' bit sounds scary to patients).

Normally, the nuclei of atoms are oriented in space in random directions, but in the presence of a strong magnetic field (and these things contain very strong superconducting magnets), it is energetically favourable for nuclei containing unpaired protons to line up with the field. Pulsing the sample with a radio-frequency burst (typically in the hundreds of MHz depending on the field strength) gives the nuclei enough energy to spin freely. They can then re-emit radio frequency photons to settl back into field alignment, which is what is measured by the spectrometer. The type of nucleus and environment it is in (other nearby atoms bonded to it) affect the frequency of those radio photons.

Atoms with an even number of protons (such as carbon and oxygen) don't give any signal at all because the protons go round in pairs with their spin aligned opposite to each other, efectively cancelling each other's spin, and therfore not lining up with the field. It is also why expensive solvents containing deuterium, rather than hydrogen (such as heavy water) are used for samples, otherwise the signal from the solvent swamps the signal you are actually interested in. In most organic samples, NMR is only looking at the hydrogen atoms, although IIRC, compounds with nitrgoen or phosphorus can give more complex spectra.

So, the tl;dr; is that NMR gives information about protons, not electrons. Although the electron density of nearby atoms can shift the signal to a lower frequency (known as down-field shifting), the interesting signals come from 'coupling' between other nearby atoms with odd numbers of protons, which splits single peaks into patterns of multiples.

Boffins have fabricated microscopic sci-fi tractor beams for real

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Re: using beams of light to manipulate atoms.

...and I don't know who down-voted the OP. For someone not versed in relativistic mechanics, it was a perfectly reasonable question. It seems a bit off to down-vote someone for wanting to learn.

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Re: using beams of light to manipulate atoms.

But ( and I know I'm wrong about this, but that doesn't mean I understand ), if they're massless then the force they exert is their speed multiplied by zero?

Newtonian mechanics (F=mv) applies pretty well at non-relativistic speeds (i.e. anything travelling at under an appreciable fraction of the speed of light). Photons travel at the speed of light (in a vacuum, anyway), so Einstein's pesky general realtivity comes into effect, and those equations get a whole load more terms in them.

'BMW, Airbus and Siemens' get the Brexit spending shakes

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Re: BMW and Airbus have more to worry about...

No-one ever promised that Brexit would be anything but hard work

I recall a lot of promises from the likes of Farage, Johnson, Gove, et al. None of them were promising hard work, the promises we did get took the form of "£350 million a week", "taking back control", "controlling immigration", "the easiest deal in histroy", etc., etc. All total bullshit. You must have been observing a different referendum campaign to the rest of us...

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Re: "Keep calm and carry on"

The UK has given notice, and the EU has set a deadline.

Not strictly true; The Prime Minister gave A50 notice to the EU parliament, and herself set a pretty arbitrary deadline. There are pretty good indications that the other EU nations would have little trouble agreeing to an extention of this limit, or indeed a withdrawal of the A50 notice entirely. The only reason May won't do this is the impression she has given herself that she is in control and competent, and won't have to backpedal when she can't get a deal involving magical unicorns for all - in other words she doesn't want to lose credibility, not realising that she doesn't have any left anyway.

Erm... what did you say again, dear reader?

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I think Norman's problem is with padding words

You like know, like some people like use like like like every like other word like in a sentence. Like.

Unlike.

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Re: Actually ...

... here in the US, we still spell them correctly. You lot bastardized them.

Whilst this may be historically accurate, in that the US retained one variant spelling, whilst the UK retained the other, back at a time when either was probably considered to be perfectly acceptable, would you care to explain, on behalf of your fellow Left-Pondians, why you decided to start arbitrarily dropping letters from words like colour, labour, etc.?

I have heard (and I'm not sure how much truth there is to this, or whether it is apocryphal), that this was done to save money on newspaper adverts, when they were paid for by the letter, and free newspapers being one of the few printed things that many Americans were able to get hold of at the time, these spellings became common usage as a result.

BT, beware: Cityfibre reveals plan to shovel £2.5bn under Britain's rural streets

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Meanwhile Virgin Media's response...

...will be to wait for them to go out of business on the back of the huge debts incurred when the digging-up of pavements doesn't go entirely to plan, and buy the company's assets for £1.

*cough* NTL *cough*

*cough* Telewest *cough*

London flatmate (Julian Assange) sues landlord (government of Ecuador) in human rights spat

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Re: Lets Get Real

Perhaps the allegations were fabricated, but then is that not the case in many rape claims?

No.

Next time, actually bother to find out whether the thing you are typing is true or not before hitting that 'post' button.

The evidence suggests that the vast majority of rape/serious sexual assault claims by women against men are true. To claim otherwise is basically blaming the victims. The thing is, human beings (en masse) are a nasty lot, and do all sorts of nasty things to each other. Men are far more likely to do more and nastier things than women (that is not to say that women can't be violent criminals, but on balance, most of those are male). Many rapists commit their crimes knowing full well that there will be little evidence to prove that what they did was not consensual, and that it will be hard to prove a case against them. Bear in mind that most rapes are not the violent dragged-off-into-the-bushes kind, but happen when men take advantage of someone they know, often when under the influence of drink or drugs, in a private situation. You (probably) are not a rapist yourself, so wouldn't believe the sheer number of women this happens to. The odds are that several women you know have been raped, and you know nothing about it.

Anyway, rant over. Short answer:

No. You are wrong.

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Re: I really hope he gets the boot

He's a human being after all. Would any human being "want" to get arrested by a TLA notorious for prisoners going poof?

Those two women he allegedly raped in Sweden are human beings as well. It's worth remembering that he was in Sweden for some time after the leaks he is allegedly worried about, without any apparent concern about rendition to the US. He only seems to have become worried about this after he ran away from Sweden to the UK after these allegations came to light, and he only 'sought asylum' in the Ecuadorian embassy after being picked up by the UK police so that the Swedish prosecutors could catch up with him, and bailed - which he promptly skipped out on. it's also worth remembering that the UK has a far less stringent extradition treaty with the US than Sweden does, so if he was, as he claims, seeking to avoid extradition there from Sweden, the UK is about the last place he would have wanted to come.

Occam's Razor would suggest that, rather than a vast conspiracy against him by US TLAs, the Swedish Government, the British Government, and the Ecuadorian Government, to lock him up (and lets not forget that the person who actually leaked those documents has already been freed), it seems much more likely that here is a guy with an inflated sense of self-importance running from justice from a country where the idea of sexual consent is a bit more rigorous than his home nation.

European Commission: We've called off the lawyers over Ireland's late collection of Apple back taxes

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Re: Helping out a mate?

do you remember who had the lowest incidence of infections animal diseases?

I guess the report in the news yesterday of the new case of BSE on a Scottish farm passed you by then.

...and if you think the EU is trying to withhold drugs and other imports (such as 60% of our food), the root of that problem is not with the EU, it will be with our own customs and border checks, which, if we leave the EU with no deal will not be up to scratch, meaning the trucks bringing stuff into this country won't be able to leave with any goods going back to the continent, in turn making their round-trips uneconomical. Nobody's going to pay for an empty 22-tonner to sit on a ferry between Dover and Calais for six hours when the margins in the logistics business are already slim. Even less so have a full truck sit at Calais for 48+ hours while its contents are checked, hoping that they aren't perishable.

The only organisation threatening to turn us into a third-world nation is the Conservative and Unionist Party who got us into this ridiculous mess in the first place, with no plan A on how to sort it out, let alone a plan B. But then again, their rich tax-exile donors are doing quite nicely off the economic damage it is doing to our country, so they are happy.

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Re: Weren't there protest in Dublin about hosuing costs recently?

Apple have their EU headquarters in Cork. For those that know anything about Irish geography, Cork is a good few hours drive South-West of Dublin, and Apple being based there is unlikely to be that cause of elevated housing prices in Dublin.

Now, if you were to talk about the other tech companies in Dublin, which bring people into the city, and the previous collapse in the housing market about ten years back, when loads of newly built houses in "ghost estates" had to be demolished, making developers understandably reluctant to build new housing, then you might be getting closer to the root causes of those housing protests.

Silent running: Computer sounds are so '90s

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Re: I still get wound up...

"Do you have permission to trespass on this land?" See? It's one of those questions where the English "Yes/No" response is severely lacking. The Japanese have a response though, Mu!

Not having permission to do so doesn't stop you from doing it. It's like saying I can't be drinking my mug of tea because nobody gave me permission to do so.

Unlike the French system of law, where technically nothing that is not explicitly legislated as being legal is allowed, English law starts from the position that anything that is not specifically disallowed by law is allowed, such as trespassing on another's land without permission.

On the other hand, it's perfectly possible for a landowner to say to someone, "go ahead and trespass on that bit of land any time you want". The permission may be moot, as they would not have been forbidden from doing so in the first place, but seeking permission to go onto someone's land is generally considered good manners. Also worth noting that there are places where trespass is definitely NOT allowed, such as land owned by the MOD, which could be much more hazardous to your health than pretending to be a cow in a farmer's field.

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Re: I still get wound up...

Because of course there are places in the world where trespassers do have permission... *AAARRRGGGHHH!*

In the UK, they're called public rights of way (usually footpaths or bridleways), and may cross private land, much to the annoyance of some in the farming community.

Also, as noted by the poster above, trespass isn't a crime in the UK. If you leave your front door open, and someone comes into your house, they're not committing a crime unless they cause damage, steal something, or become aggressive. I'm not sure you could even have them arrested if they refused to leave.

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Boffin

Re: Sage 50!

Sage 200 was worse than Sage 50 is? Are Sage numbering backwards or was that a typo?

IIRC Sage has a suite of products named Line 50, Line 100 and Line 200, incorporating different types of ledger in each.

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Re: Sage 50!

If it's using the windows beep, is it not possible to change the sound associated with that beep to silent?

Failing that, find the .wav file it's playing, rename it and replace it with a zero-byte file with the same name?

Someone's in hot water: Tea party super PAC group 'spilled 500,000+ voters' info' all over web

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Re: Tea Party hypocrisy

Well, Hilary didn't get locked up, so why would these guys? It's not like it was Confidential, Secret or Top Secret info, right?

Quite right, she didn't get locked up, just like you didn't read the OP's post properly. There was no mention there of Democrats chanting for the TP people to be locked up, their point was that by their own 'logic', those same people should now be chanting to lock themselves up.

Disclaimer - before you start categorising me as an enemy voter, I'm not a supporter of any US political party, I'm not even left-pondian, but I am perfectly able to observe and comment upon the idiocy on display there.

Sure, Europe. Here's our Android suite without Search, Chrome apps. Now pay the Google tax

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The EU can always fire back and say Google must make non-slurp versions of everything if they want to make manufacturers pay for them.

Don't forget the also-important advertisement free.

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At the moment, Android phones are cheaper because Google don't charge for all the other bits that they bundle with their money-makers (Search and Chrome). A phone with FF and DDG instead would be more expensive because Google would be charging a licence fee for the other apps, and most importantly, the Play Store. Of course, you could have a phone without those and side-load all your apps. Most users aren't going to want something that doesn't just "work out of the box" though, or which uses a third-party app store that has nothing in it but tumbleweed.

As angels, rich dudebros suck: 1 in 5 Y Combinator women tech founders say they were sexually harassed

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Re: How long will it be...

Apart from the fact that nobody is likely to approach an 'Angel' investor directly, it'll be the other way around (pretty much by definition of the term), you do know how vanishingly rare false accusations of sexual impropriety are by women against men are, don't you? So rare that it makes then newsworthy, and I can only think of one case that made the news in this country in the last couple of years (the false accuser, a female law student who made accusations against a man in order to get a deferral of her exams was imprisoned for her trouble).

What is sadly much, much more common is women not being believed or being victimised or ignored when something horrible happens. And that something horrible happens all the time because of arseholes that frankly make me ashamed of my own gender. If you want to be one of those victim-blamers, I've got a good hard kick in the nuts you can have. It's your fault apparently for acting like you wanted it.

Dating app for Trump loners commits YUGE blunder: It leaks more than the West Wing

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Trollface

If you've got nothing to hide, there'e nothing to fear!

Amirite?

Leaked memo: No internet until you clean your bathroom, Ecuador told Julian Assange

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Re: So in other words

I feel sorry for the Ecuadorians, he's clearly a vexatious asylee, and they must be sorely regretting their decision to let him in by now.

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So, by your reasoning, if I'm ever on the run from the law, I can come and sleep on your sofa, eat from your fridge, and if you ask me to clean the toilet after myself, I'm being imprisoned, despite the fact that I can leave at any time and am living rent free in your house, and you're not handing me over to the cops?

You, sir, are a total bell-end.

Shortages, price rises, recession: Tech industry preps for hard Brexit

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I was born in 1975 so didn't take part in the last referendum, obviously. But it was made incredibly clear, both by politicians and in the press at the time, that increasing political union was the goal of the European project.

Well said. It is, in fact, pretty much explicitly stated in the pre-amble to the Treaty of Rome, in 1957:

Full text of the Treaty of Rome.

But of course, to the quitters, facts and evidence are anathema. They are the purview of those horrible untrustworthy experts that Slithy Gove warned us about, after all.

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Re: And all we can do...

Worth noting that for the last march for a people's vote a few months ago, Bristol for Europe, my local campaign group, filled two coaches of people. There were around 150,000 people on that march (and a few hundred gammons / kippers on the counter-march). As of last week, BfE had sold out tickets for eight coaches for the coming march. If we use that as an indicator of how many people are likely to turn up this weekend, if the weather is nice, that will be somewhere north of 1M people trying to get into Parliament Square.

For a general rule-of-thumb, for each person who turns up to a demonstration, there are twenty others who also have the same strongly-felt political opinion (and politicians generally use this rule-of thumb when gauging public opinion), so lets call that 20M+ people. That is already several million more people than the 17.4M who voted to leave the EU in 2016. Of course, everyone on that march will be a Russian Troll™ trying to interfere with the democratic rights of those freedom loving quitters.

Such demonstrations are important (and an important part of democracy) because they are one of the best ways of making governments sit up and take notice of what the people are saying.

It's looking less and less likely that May will get a deal that will satisfy Parliament (and looking more likely that she will get no deal at all), it is up to us to make it known that it is time for her to stop playing the "will of the people" game and become a proper grown-up states-person who is able to put the interests of the country ahead of the interests of her own career, or her party's. And lets face it, the Tory Party isn't exactly going to come out the far end of this smelling of roses in any eventuality.

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Re: And all we can do...

Going in to the Referendum it was made very, VERY clear that it was a one-time vote with a binding result.

I'm sorry, but that is total tosh. When parliament voted on the enabling bill for the referendum, the preamble for the bill, which is available on Hansard, so you can check it for yourself, explicitly stated several things:

- The bill was advisory

- The bill was non-binding

- For the bill to be made non-advisory and binding would require it to be re-written to require a super-majority and to include all UK citizens of voting age (which it did not, UK nationals living abroad for more than 10 years were excluded, skewing the results quite a bit)

Just because David Cameron then stated that the result of the referendum would be acted on doesn't bind parliament in any way. The Prime Minister may be the leader of the house, but they are not the ruler of the house, and the other 650 odd MPs are elected to represent their constituencies, not their party, and certainly not the leader of the party with the most votes.

The only reason the likes of May and Corbyn insist that the results of the referendum "must be respected" is that they know that for them to say otherwise would invite a political backlash against themselves. They have only their own interests at heart, not those of the country, which should be abundantly clear to anyone who has taken even a cursory glance at any politicians ever*.

*Hyperbole aside, some politicians are worse than others, an my local MP is actually not too bad. Those that rise to the top, however, do so not because they represent the people the best, but because they are the best at rising to the top of politics, which requires an entirely different skill-set.

Take my advice: The only safe ID is a fake ID

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Re: Silly first name.

Or are we all obliged to us Cyrillic when using a Greek or Russian name, or pin yin when communicating with a Chinese person .

Not sure you'll find many Greek names written in Cyrillic, which is the writing system introduced to Russian-speakers by Saint Cyril in the 5th Century, and is both similar to, and quite different from, the Greek alphabet.

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Re: Casino Royale

There's only only one decent Bond Film called "Casino Royale" and it certainly doesn't feature Daniel Craig in it...

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Re: Silly first name.

...

Gráinne not Gronnyer

Cliona not Cleaner

...

Aren't Gaelic names fun?

Bloke gets six months for fixing up Russia's US election trolls with bank accounts, fake identities

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Re: When does the UK start sentencing people?

Exactly, nobody's about to start investigating their own sources of funding...

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Holmes

Re: Presidential Pardon...

Remind me again, does stoking racial (and societal) tensions favour the right-wing candidate, or the slightly-left-of-right-wing one more?

Hint: "Divide and Conquer" isn't really very socialist.

Astroboffins discover when white and brown dwarfs mix, the results are rather explosive

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Re: Interesting what a range of chemcials you can make just banging some near stars together

Actually, if my memory serves me correctly, beryllium isn't produced in stellar nucleosynthesis (or in the Big Bang for that matter) in any appreciable amount for some reason or other to do with the relative energies of fusion of the light elements. It's actually a lot rarer in the universe than any of the other light elements as a result, apparently being largely synthesised from cosmic ray collisions, according to Wikipedia.

Don't make us pay compensation for employee data breach, Morrisons begs UK court

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Re: You shouldn't be able to get to there from here.

Computer security is easy, for anyone who has never had any sort of involvement in it.

For anyone who actually knows about it, they know it is Hard. Reading a few of Bruce Schneier's blogs, or some of his books will give you a sense of just how hard it is.

Often companies whose main business is computer security get it wrong. Morrisons is a supermarket.

What could be more embarrassing for a Russian spy: Their info splashed online – or that they drive a Lada?

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Russia isn't part of the EU, despite what Jeremy Hunt might have you think.

HMRC rapped as Brexit looms and customs IT release slips again

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Re: no surprise

@Ledswinger

You're quite right, he did miss out "fantasist".

Nobody's going to argue that there are no federalists in the EU, but to loudly proclaim that the EU is an "ever more centralised single state of Greater Europe" belies a total disconnect with what is actually going on in European politics.

Of course, if UK.gov doesn't come to its senses and abort brextastrophe* before it is too late, that will still leave 27 sovereign states with their own vetoes on any federalist proposals, which is why none of them ever go anywhere when they do pop up. I can't imagine Italy, or Hungary, or for that matter, even Germany going along with such stuff, because: it's fantasy, and those who seriously believe it are, by definition fantasists.

*lets face it, we've got enough stupid portmanteau words to do with leaving the EU, one more isn't going to hurt now, is it?