back to article SpaceX finally Falcon flings NASA's TESS into orbit

NASA’s TESS spacecraft is in orbit following a successful launch from Cape Canaveral’s Space Launch Complex 40. SpaceX’s Falcon 9 left the launch pad at 22:51 UTC after a delay to deal with unspecified issues with the rocket’s guidance systems. The first stage engines shut down just over two minutes later as planned. The …

  1. Lee D Silver badge

    Except for the second-stage of the rocket, which they now just fire out of orbit, apparently.

    Nice to know that we're not just littering our planet but the rest of the solar system too.

    1. alain williams Silver badge

      second stage ?

      What should they do with the second stage other than throw it away ?

      One idea: park it in orbit and put it up for sale. The cost of taking it up X hundred miles has been paid, so sometime it might be of interest to someone who is building something large upstairs and who needs a lot of metal. I'm assuming that it could be melted/reformed into something else.

      1. duhmb

        Re: second stage ?

        They should park them all l4 or l5 if enough reaction mass can be spared?

    2. Steve Todd

      If you had the first clue about orbital mechanics you’d realise the above is wrong. The second stage is de-orbited and burns up rather than leaving junk up there. It would be far too expensive in fuel to fling it beyond earth orbit, and there’s far too much junk to allow adding to the pile.

      1. asphytxtc

        > If you had the first clue about orbital mechanics you’d realise the above is wrong.

        Actually, I hate to break this to you, but the second stage for TESS did indeed go into heliocentric orbit. The remaining fuel in the second stage was only enough to do one of two things, burn at apogee to lower perigee into the atmosphere, or burn after deployment to reach a hyperbolic orbit.

        Since the second stage doesn't have the endurance to coast the 6 hours to apogee (batteries, lox boil-off etc) the decision was made to burn to earth escape and enter a heliocentric orbit.

        https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2018/04/tess-launch-mission-search-near-earth-exoplanets/

        However, I will agree, a majority of second stages are intentionally deorbited :)

        1. Andy The Hat Silver badge

          Good info asphytxtc. Look up "graveyard orbit" too, the Wiki page is quite good ...

          1. Lee D Silver badge

            I did actually research THIS LAUNCH specifically before writing this post(*)... and they just pushed the second-stage out of orbit. Apologies will be accepted in the form of cash, credit card, Bitcoin or Paypal... no cheques please.

            Same as the Tesla-in-orbit. Great gimmick. Now where's it going to end up. It's hard enough to launch through the space junk now without encountering 100-year-old space junk returning on a huge chaotic orbit because a private firm just shoved it away from Earth with no way to tell where it would end up.

            (*) The reason... because ALMOST EVERY LAUNCH they do that claims to "land back" in some fashion actually fails - even if it's only one rocket, one stage, or that they have to abort the landing, the "we re-use rockets" thing is only technically correct.

            More often than you might think they destroy the drone-ships that they are landing on. They don't publicise it much because they can just say "Hey, we re-used a booster from flight A" and everyone just goes "cool" without checking facts... *cough*.

            1. SkippyBing

              'Now where's it going to end up.'

              I refer you to the Big Sky Theory, except in this case Big isn't really a generous enough term.

            2. Bronek Kozicki

              @Lee D whoever gave you lessons in trolling, ask them for a refund.

    3. Shadowmanx2012
      Meh

      Nice to know that we're not just littering our planet but the rest of the solar system too.

      Was that seriously the first thing that you thought of?

      AJ

      1. Tikimon
        Facepalm

        Was that seriously the first thing that you thought of?

        Here, in these politically-charged forums? Where people approve or condemn based solely on whether something aligns with their ideological beliefs? Yep, it was the first thing he thought of!

        Nasty old exploiter Tesla (owned by a Rich Guy so it's evil) can't be allowed credit for anything good. So they land and re-use first stages that NOBODY ever did before? They're still an awful company because they didn't clean up the second stages that nobody ever has. Evil Tesla! Bad! Bad!

        Gah...

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Nice to know that we're not just littering our planet but the rest of the solar system too.

      Paint it green with golden lettering.

      "Carlsberg: Probably the best beer in this fracking solar system"

      1. Mark Exclamation

        Carlsberg is not a beer; it's a lager.

    5. Bill Gray

      On the off chance that you're serious here:

      Our littering habits are a serious problem in low-earth orbit, and somewhat so in the geosynch belt. Something really ought to be done about this (not having ASAT tests make more shrapnel would be a nice start). Danger at other altitudes is minimal, because Space Is Big.

      The second stage will be in an heliocentric orbit, just inside that of the earth (but touching it at aphelion). Its orbital period should be roughly 8/9 of a year, meaning there's a chance we'll see it in eight years and mistake it for a near-earth asteroid (that sort of thing has happened several times already, once with the SIV-B stage from Apollo 12, which came back to earth's neighborhood for a bit in 2003.)

      But compared to the amount of rocks already in heliocentric orbit, we're in no danger of having things get cluttered up there.

  2. ravenviz Silver badge

    Wondering whether we can ever get 100% recoverable stages notwithstanding environmental conditions, weather, sea conditions, etc.

    1. annodomini2

      BFR

      That's the aim with BFR.

      But to give you an idea of the cost of recovering the 2nd stage, current estimates put BFR Reusable payload at 150t to LEO, Expendable is 300t+.

      More than 1/2 the payload capability is lost for reusability of the rocket.

      Given about 1/3 is lost for stage 1, based on F9.

      The current F9 GTO reusable payload is about 5.5t, if they were to reuse the 2nd stage that may drop to 4t or less.

      But this obviously depends on the target orbit of the payload.

    2. annodomini2

      Skylon

      The other potential option being Skylon, i.e. no stages at all, so you recover the whole vehicle.

  3. not.known@this.address
    Coat

    "Such landings are in danger of becoming routine, a tribute to the engineering involved."

    Some things should NEVER be considered routine, at least while using small numbers of slightly tamed giant fireworks as launch vehicles. We've lost too many pioneers and had too many near-misses due to complacency over 'routine' operations.

    Wait until we have a reliable means to get 'em out and bring 'em back (in a hurry or earlier than planned, if/when necessary) before saying it's routine, please.

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What about Mr Steven

    Did Catchy-McCatch-Face get the fairing this time?

    1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge

      Re: What about Mr Steven

      They didn't attempt it on this launch. Don't know why. Though I can imagine it being that the fairing was designed ages ago - it being a NASA mission that will have been years in the planning.

      1. Spudley

        Re: What about Mr Steven

        They didn't attempt it on this launch. Don't know why.

        The main reason is that Mr Steven is based in California, and can only realistically be deployed for Vandenberg launches.

        Apparently though, they did still do the whole parachute thing to recover the fairing, albeit with a wet landing. I don't believe that they can reuse a fairing once it's got wet, so presumably they did this in order to get more data about how the parachutes perform, in order to help with the catching next time.

        As far as I know, they haven't released any information about how it all went so far this time. But there's a reasonable chance that someone will photograph the boat coming home over the next few days with the fairings on board.

  5. Mr Youmustbe Fuckingjoking

    Arithmetic

    If you're going to count Falcon Heavy as three launches instead of one you have to remember to subtract the one before adding the three : 27 launches not 28.

    1. Valerion

      Re: Arithmetic

      No you don't. The article was counting launches of the Falcon 9, of which there are 25. Not launches of all types of Falcons.

      If you include the Falcon Heavy, which uses 3 boosters (none included in the 25), then it's 28.

  6. Pete4000uk

    Always get nurvous

    When these things launch. God forbid the James Webb ST gets destroyed on launch.

    1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
      Devil

      Re: Always get nurvous

      That suggests a new word

      NERVAous - definition: anxiety and fear of being present at the launch of a nuclear rocket.

    2. Terje

      Re: Always get nurvous

      Are you actually implying that the JWST will ever be ready to launch? what strange and wonderful world do you live in and can I come and join you?

    3. phuzz Silver badge

      Re: Always get nurvous

      The James Webb is supposed to be launched on an Ariane 5, although that is supposed to be replaced by the Ariane 6 in 2022 or so. It's possible it might end up on a SpaceX rocket.

      Who knows basically. At the current rate of progress we'll be able to just drag it up a space elevator and give it a shove.

      1. annodomini2

        Re: Always get nurvous

        Unlikely as ESA are funding the launch.

  7. kmac499

    How about we....

    I am continually astonished by engineers who turn the daft idea created down the pub on a friday night into something that actually works.

    You can imagine the converation

    Eng1 how we gonna save money ?

    Eng2 re use 1st stage

    Eng1 how

    Eng3 land it back

    Eng1 in the ocean

    Eng4 howabout on a barge

    Eng1 Fall back from space do a 180 and land on a postage stamp in the sea

    Pause....

    Eng1 tell you what if by next friday you can show how, I'll buy the beers

    Chorus DONE.....

    1. Andy The Hat Silver badge

      Re: How about we....

      They'll be landing stuff by sky-crane on Mars next ...

    2. Gene Cash Silver badge

      Re: How about we....

      That's pretty much how SpaceX actually works... there's a series of web vids by a NASA bloke assigned to SpaceX to transfer the PICA heatshield tech to them. It's on the NASA YouTube channel.

      It was quite the culture shock for him. Whereas NASA would have done months of studies detailing every possible alternative, then months of meetings to decide between the alternatives, SpaceX looks at everything and as soon as they're "51% sure something will work" then Musk holds a meeting of everyone involved, they make a decision, then they run with that.

      Imagine that, a top level meeting where decisions are actually made and followed through.

      If it doesn't work, they go "whelp... didn't work" and back off and try something else.

      The NASA guy was just left standing with his mouth open going "wow"

      1. PerspexAvenger

        Re: How about we....

        In case you're interested, I believe the series mentioned is the one here:

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ywp6dnJeufw&list=PLpEqMkxe7Xk_00sUp7g_wYkAIIuVbGvYz

        The individual vid where it's (first, at least, I imagine) mentioned is:

        https://youtu.be/P06X2TZUKZU

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: How about we....

      In the 1970s senior members of the O/S development team used to go to a local pub for a few pints at lunchtime. It was not unknown for them to discuss a "go faster" feature - possibly sketch it on the back of a table mat - then code it into the master source when they returned to the office.

      In one case it then took 18 months of troubleshooting customer systems to get the bugs out of the code's side-effects.

  8. Gene Cash Silver badge

    Lunar Resonant Orbit

    Scott Manley (of Kerbal Space Program lets-play fame) has put up a vid describing the unique orbit TESS is in, and the advantages thereof... He's not quite a boffin, but he's Scottish and therefore quite the engineering type.

  9. Anonymous Custard
    Trollface

    What duck?

    The Hawthorne, California team will wing its way to Cape Canaveral, Florida on 4 May for the Bangabandhu 1 launch on the very first of the block fives.

    OK admit it, how many other Pratchett fans first read that as Bangbangduc?

    1. Alister
      Thumb Up

      Re: What duck?

      Yep :)

  10. JJKing
    Coat

    That's not nice.

    Apologies will be accepted in the form of cash, credit card, Bitcoin or Paypal... no cheques please.

    No cheques? Aren't you being a tad Prague-matic?

    Sorry but I must leave immediately before I am stoned to death with old fruit.

  11. Mystereed

    Happy it is up safely...

    ...but seriously disappointed it didn't go up on the planned date as I was in Florida and we had managed to get in to the Kennedy Visitor Center car park that afternoon :-(

    Had to fly back to the UK the next day. Argh!

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