RE: Geoff Mackenzie, Patrick Ernst, Francis Fish, Aitor
RE: Geoff Mackenzie - "....No, the reason is that justice traditionally works the other way around. But hey, you're right, we shouldn't let the trifling issue of torture get in the way of convicting people on the basis of their own confessions...." One of the reasons Binyam Mohamed gave for his asylum application was his Islamic views were unpopular with the Ethiopian Government, because he was linked to the same people that became the AQ-wannabees the Islamic Courts whom Ethipia was fighting a war against at the time. Previously, the UK Government had given asylum to many Islamists under international guidelines, which is why the Saudis were so annoyed with us for many years. I could go on, but Binyam Mohamed has already got a big enough strike against him there to fall foul of the current Ant-Terror legislation, which was why his application was denied so many years ago (Mr Lewis seems to have forgotten to mention this when he labelled him "the one-time UK resident"). There is also no physical proof of any torture in this case, something that has not stopped Clive Stafford Smith slandering both the US and Morrocan and Pakistani intelligence services as he knows he can say what he likes to the press with no recourse for the authourities. In fact, in all the cases Smith has raised, there has not been one single incidence where torture has been proven by medical examination. Now, I have a scar from a minor bike accident twenty-five years ago, are you telling me the Pakistanis, Algerians and Morrocans are so adept they can leave absolutely no marks even after the prolonged and violent beatings Mr Smith and his fans claim, that all the physical evidence would just heal right up in two years? Unlikley. Then we can get onto Binyam Mohamed's ludicrous excuse for being in Afghanistan in 2001 - for rehabilitation from his drug habit! His attendance at an AQ camp has been established from US intel (not "tortured" confessions), it is this that Smith is trying to discredit. Not surprisingly, the US are not too keen on explaining exactly what methods they used to gather info on camp attendees as it will endanger current and future US operations, and Smith knows that he can try and use this to force the US to drop the case. At this point, I don't think Binyam Mohamed is worth endangering that information for.
RE: Patrick Ernst
"You are any angry little man...." Yes, I'm angry, but not so little, and quite confidant in my own physical capabilities. Or is it your debating style just to immediately accuse anyone that doesn't agree with you of being "little-minded"? In which case, I am equally capable of just referring to yourself as a frustrated, kneejerk liberal with zero real-world experience. Or just a tosser. ".... All your wailings are accusations and allegations. If we work with the idea of "Innocent unless proven guilty" then even bin Laden is innocent as is Binyam; unless proven beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law. Not some rigged military (political) court...." There are comprehensive guidelines based in US law which cover the military tribunals, they are not "rigged". This is shown by the Salim Hamdan trial where he escaped the conspiracy charge due to lack of evidence - if it had been rigged he would already be in the queue for the gas chamber (which is where I actually think he deserves to be, but then that's just my opinion). Compare this to his boss's or Taleban methods of trial and I think he won't be complaining, but I'm sure all you frustrated, kneejerk liberals will be.
RE: Francis Fish - "...We can't complain about the ID card culture and all the other expensive police-state crap our leaders are imposing on us and then stand idly by when others' rights are abused. T'would be hypocrisy...." Ah, but then you make the usual liberal mistake of assuming everyone must agree with you, becasue you think you are right and therefore everyone with half a clue must agree with you. Sorry, but I do support the ID card idea, I just don't like the rediculously expensive and flawed method of implementation. I also don't have any issues with the majority of current Government ant-terror legislation. I know, you'll be calling me a fascist in a moment - standard libtard response when they haven't got anything else to say.
RE: Aitor - "Matt, so if you look suspicious, I guess it would be OK if the police torture you 2 YEARS until you sign a confession...." Yes, I'm sure all the intelligence services around the world have time and people to spare to torture at random. When I was a stoodie living in London, I used to often be walking home at two or three in the morning through London, and was quite often stopped and searched by Police as I was usually carrying a bag. Given the high levels of crime in the area, both muggings and break-ins, and that the majority were committed by "white youths aged between sixteen and twenty-five", it was not surprising that I came in for suspicion. I don't begrudge them their actions, in fact I was thankful they were so committed to doing their job. However, a black friend whom had never been stopped said he would have complained. It was his mindset that all Police were racist, as it is so obviously your mindset that all intelligence services are Big Brother types looking to get "the little man". Might I suggest you open your eyes and do a little thinking for yourself before saying you are ashamed of the men and women working hard to ensure your security.
And in asnwer to all, I also do not look traditionally English, in fact most people assume I am French or Mediterranean on first meeting. I also have the misfortune to have previously spent some time with the daughter of a Lebanese gun-runner. I didn't know what her father did at the time. This has caused me to be stopped many times at international customs both here and abroad, and has once led to my detainmant by the Israeli border police for a period of three hours. In each case, I realised they were simply doing their job, not being malicious. Oh, and the Israelis didn't immediately bundle me into a room and start torturing me either! They were actually very polite. Maybe I should give Clive Stafford Smith a call, though, that chair the Israelis gave me was a bit hard....