back to article Microsoft raises pistol, pulls the trigger on Windows 7, 8 updates for new Intel, AMD chips

Microsoft has cut software updates and tweaks for computers powered by Intel and AMD's latest-generation processors running old versions of Windows. The Redmond giant is no longer serving software fixes to PCs and other systems that run Windows 7 or Windows 8.1 on Intel's fresh new Kaby Lake or AMD's hot-off-the-fab Ryzen …

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  1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    Looking at it from MS's PoV, they expect your to run Office 365 on their boxes, other stuff on Azure on their boxes. So what difference can a bit of "telemetry" make?

  2. earl grey
    FAIL

    " fewer headaches for its programmers"

    Well, boo hoo Microsoft. Should we call the WAHmbulance for you now or later?

  3. Charlie Clark Silver badge

    What I don't understand

    Assuming that the descendants of Windows NT still use something like HAL for abstracting the hardware, why there should be problems like this at all. I can understand Windows 7 not receiving hardware-dependent acceleration that only newer chips support, but for the rest? It's x86_64, SSE, SIMD, etc.

    If I had a Windows environment I'd very strongly consider switching to a stripped down unix just for running Windows VMs.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What I don't understand

      Exactly. But for some very specific code - i.e. some very low level kernel code, Hyper-V and maybe .NET jitters - what could be so CPU specific?? Especially for code that still needs to run on older models, and for security fixes that have very little to do with CPU architectures and a lot with higher level protocols and implementations. Or MS wants us to believe that SMB is implemented directly at the CPU level in handcrafted assembly??

      It looks just another lame excuse to desperately push customers towards Windows 10.

  4. Updraft102

    Worse than WGA

    Remember WGA, or Windows Genuine Advantage? It was the predecessor to the current Windows Activation Technology. It blocked optional updates and any kind of extras you may want to download from MS, but not security updates. Even if MS thought your Windows XP was pirated, they still wanted you to be up to date on security patches... not out of concern for the pirates themselves, but for the legitimate Windows customers who could be negatively impacted by the unchecked spread of malware. It was simply too important to keep everyone possible patched and secure for MS to use withholding the security updates as a stick to beat on the pirates.

    Now, though, it's apparently okay to withhold updates for whatever reasons MS wishes.

    MS took away the ability for Windows 10 users to turn off updates, supposedly because they were too important to allow people to turn them off... but not so important that MS can't use it as a stick to force people to adhere to the EULA Microsoft marketing plan, which says that even though Windows 8.1 is still in mainstream support (with this being a perfect example of the kind of thing that should be covered by mainstream support) and 7 is in extended support, and even though there's nothing in the EULA of either that would allow MS to arbitrarily decide it can't be installed on certain hardware, you're not *allowed* to install them on 7th generation CPUs, simply because because MS says so.

    1. Mage Silver badge

      Re: and 7 is in extended support,

      Yet Lenovo (thankfully) was still selling Win7 pro last November, though you had to pay extra compared to Windows 10.

      I've rebooted only a few times into Win7 rather than Linux Mint, to convert some files to format a Linux program can read.

  5. Marty McFly Silver badge
    Mushroom

    Wrong quote

    El Reg quoted: "This enables us to focus on deep integration between Windows and the silicon, while maintaining maximum reliability and compatibility with previous generations of platform and silicon."

    It should have read: "This enables us to focus on deep integration between Windows and your wallet, while maintaining maximum profitability by selling all the previously captured information about you"

  6. Howard Hanek
    Unhappy

    Two Words

    AI - Microsoft

    The oxymoron of oxymorons. The pinnacle of impossibility. Elevating the BSOD to new impossible heights of indecipherability.

  7. Jim-234

    The new world where you own nothing - you are the "revenue item"

    It seems too many technology companies are now on the bandwagon of your "customers" are not actually "customers" but are rather your "generators of revenue stream" and you milk everything you can from them either by selling all their habits & private data, or forcing them into direct paid subscription models.

    In my opinion, it seems the world is racing down a path back to the days of a small group of mega rich overlords who owned everything and then the masses of poor peons slaving away for subsistence, always being renters never having any property they actually own.

    Instead of rich families it's now Global Mega Corporations.

    Before long I think a lot of the software / technology world will be divided into 2 camps:

    The crowd who thinks it's normal to basically have your credit card hooked up to your computer & everything you run is on subscription (or "free" if you give them all your personal information)

    The enlightened and stubborn rebels who use open source software & still can build & repair their own devices, running non-commercial software.

    You notice also this big "cloud" push... why have your own servers and your own data... just give us all your data and pay us whatever we demand for access to it & having it work... it's perfect... you are never going to not pay us are you? So the plan is something like 3 big mega corporations (probably microsoft/google/amazon) hold most of everybody's data and most of the servers.

    Microsoft doesn't care about the few enlightened rebel technical users raging against the corporate machine. They are fully committed to using their OS near monopoly leverage to turn into the next google/facebook. They don't want to sell you a new OS, they have to "give" you the OS and in return lock you into being their "revenue generator" with ads, selling your info / habits, pushing other subscription games & items etc. They need to get a guaranteed income stream from their users & nothing will stand in the way.

    The problem is they will probably get away with it, as too many people now think as long at it's "free" well then who cares how much they are selling me as a product to everyone. For most of the average folk, they are unwilling to move off "windows" even if you help them.

    Once upon a time you bought your operating system & then when a new one came out, you bought it, if you decided it was worth your money (or got it as a bundled price with a new PC when you decided it was worth upgrading). Pretty much yours to keep and use as long as you saw fit. You gave them a 1 time payment up front (either directly or via a middleman) and were set.

    Now you can't actually buy the Microsoft Desktop operating system outright any more, you continuously pay for it. Either by them shoving ads at you, slurping your data to sell to others & being a test base for stuff before they roll it out to the corporate customers. Or you pay a constant yearly licensing fee if you are big enough to have them deem your wallet big enough for the corporate version.

    Similar to what Adobe did a few years back... NO we WON'T sell you our new updated software, it's rent it, forever paying or it stops working. So no more actually having to come out with a better product to get people to pay, just sit back and let the cash roll in and outsource someone to insert a few new things from time to time.

    Another example is Quicken with their Quickbooks product... Sorry we are going to stop supporting payroll, tax updates and other things (that you still pay for each year), unless you "upgrade" to our latest version... Latest version however is a subscription only product and if you actually dig in, they will confirm that if your subscription stops... so does the program and all your data is kind of stuck.

    The John Deere tractor mess is another example... buy the tractor... but unless you pay us continually for "maintenance" the tractor will refuse to run and you have to sign away your rights to sue us if you loose a crop because we couldn't be bothered to get to your farm on time to press the "we got paid" button on your tractor.

    1. Charles 9

      Re: The new world where you own nothing - you are the "revenue item"

      And you're saying this like it's anything new. This is pretty much standard human behavior because, in the end, barring crisis, we'll find a way to gain a leg up on our neighbors so that it's OUR kids in the next generation, not THEIRS. It's damned near instinct. And it has a historical basis.

  8. julian.smith

    Microsoft is still a thing? Who knew

    I jumped to Linux Mint 18 months ago

    Never looked back.

    1. TPX

      Re: Microsoft is still a thing? Who knew

      I am going where you are going. I have talked to a lot of people who have gone there. Being loyal to Microsoft is a losing game.

  9. Michael Sanders

    optimize?

    Did Microsoft laughably just say they are planning on optimizing windows to the silicon? Well that will be a first.

  10. Crazy Operations Guy

    Supported processor revisions

    What the hell happened to x86 while I wasn't looking? Wasn't the whole point of x86 that you could run code on both older -and- newer chips so long as the supported the features you need?

    I remember being able to run old OSes on hardware that was made 10+ years after the OS was last compiled and everything working just fine. So why wouldn't Windows 7 work on any of the new chips? Unless Intel and Microsoft are purposefully making them incompatible, there is no reason for it.

    1. Roland6 Silver badge

      Re: Supported processor revisions

      >Unless Intel and Microsoft are purposefully making them incompatible

      Currently there is no evidence that Intel or AMD are deliberately doing anything to make 7th generation chipsets incompatible with previous x86/x64 chipssets.

      1. Crazy Operations Guy

        Re: Supported processor revisions

        Yeah, nothing deliberate but it seems they aren't exactly breaking a sweat to ensure compatibility...

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Supposedly Windows 8+ won't install on Pentium 4 or earlier (except maybe some Prescott silicon, I forget) because it absolutely required support for the NX bit a.k.a. hardware-moderated data execution prevention. I think. So the kernel was simplified a bit by just not even allowing for the other case and always using NX. That's obviously completely different from cold-shouldering a combination of new hardware and old software in the security patch department.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        I may understand desupporting *older* CPU in 10 - but how they could actually not support newer ones that are backward compatible in older OS?

        It MS had said 7 and 8 won't support any new CPU feature (just like 7 never got Hyper-V and is stuck on Virtual PC, or Vista and XP never supported SSD disks) we could have understand, but it's really "difficult" to understand why they are unable to support newer processor at all which are perfectly able to run code for older ones perfectly.... it's just really a weasel marketing move.

  11. thx1138v2

    How does that great big target bulls eye feel?

    By doing this Microsoft has just painted a huge bulls eye on every non-10 Windows computer for hackers to target. Future exploits will be disclosed and only blocked/resolved in 10. So all a hacker has to do is find the earlier OS's and he's got a winner.

    They should probably move their HQ to Italy, maybe Corsica to be consistent. Win10 or WinX, as I call it, has become the "expediter" who helps your project along by not burning down your office. Extortion by any other name.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: How does that great big target bulls eye feel?

      Only if you run a brand new CPU, though. Not every non-10 Windows computer is getting hit, just the ones that apparently want/need/hope to be the fastest.

  12. Dwarf

    Trust

    Trust is earned over years, but destroyed in seconds..

    Nice move Microsoft. Why not try the other approach - listen to you customers and what they really want

    (BTW, its not Windows 10)

  13. ph0b0s

    Not quite right

    "The ruling will no doubt irk some users – such as PC gamers – who have until now opted to run Windows 7 on their new machines and prefer the interface of the older OS over that of Windows 10."

    PC gamers already got screwed by Windows 10, at launch, as only it has Directx 12. And yes I know game support is limited, but it won't always be. It has been enough of a driver so that Windows 10 is now the majority OS for PC gamers (source: Steam monthly surveys).

    Both of these two practices, plus the retrospective adding of Windows 10 spying and cumulative updates into 7 and 8.1, goes to show how MS works. Instead of making a great product that would draw users in, they first try to give the new OS away for free. And when that does not work they retrospectively bork the old OS. Says it all really....

  14. Old one

    Just pushing people to move to Linux..

  15. bjr

    This policy allows Intel to clean up the x86 architecture

    Intel's and Microsoft's dependence on each other has had a significant negative effect on the performance of their respective products. In Microsoft's case they introduced a lot of x86 specific dependencies into Windows which made sense at the time they did them but in the long run made it very difficult to port Windows to other architectures. When they did the ARM port they cleaned up that mess so WIn10 is now much cleaner than older versions of Windows. On Intel's side they've had to maintain backward's compatibility to every generation of MS OSes. As a result modern Intel processors carry around a lot of obsolete instructions and memory management modes that should have been removed years ago. With Microsoft enforcing a policy that only Win10 is supported on Kaby Lakes and beyond Intel is now free to do a much needed spring cleaning on their architecture.

  16. Kev99 Silver badge

    Whatever happened to warranty of merchantability laws? Restraint of trade? As to being able to run on older chip, BOVINE EXCREMENT! If a chip doesn't need a certain microcode or DLL, it doesn't call it. Simple.

  17. John Munyard

    Given that Windows 10 now routinely feeds all sorts of usage and application data backto the Microsoft mothership whether you want it to or not this does seem a rather arrogant move.

    All your base are belong to them I guess, as Apple aren't any better.

  18. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

    Since the OS couldn't care less what exact silicone it's running on, this is obviously just another A-hole tactic by MS. I'm getting so tired of these sh*theads.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      It definitely DOES care or there would've been a proper ARM version of Windows years ago.

  19. JJKing
    Big Brother

    Microsoft pervert deviants?

    Did Microsoft laughably just say they are planning on optimizing windows for the silly con?

    There, FTFY.

    Purchased a new(ish) laptop for my wife due to the old one being well..old. It was a new one just couldn't get the latest model due to it having the Gen 7 CPU that MS wouldn't let it run Windows 7 (or wouldn't let Win7 run on it). Even with Classic Shell on Windows Puke, it still wouldn't have looked like her old desktop. It went from a 1366 x 768 to a 1920 x 1080 res and she had issues with that. Linux is going to be a real challenge when the time comes.

    In 2004 I tried to get a school I supported to change to Linux. It would have saved them $12,000 per year but even though the pulldown menus still had File, Edit, View, Tools etc, the IT teacher didn't like it because it looked different. I wonder if they would consider it now with all the spying MS is doing on their data. If a paedophile did what MS is doing to children's data, the pervert would be locked up and rightfully given a good kicking frequently while inside. Why is Microsoft allowed to be exempt from predatory stalking?

    1. Pompous Git Silver badge
      Angel

      Re: Microsoft pervert deviants?

      "If a paedophile did what MS is doing to children's data..."
      I met a Catholic priest who was obsessed with the papal succession. I don't understand why he got so upset when I called him a Peterphile.

  20. Kiwi
    Linux

    By making sure all new PCs run Windows 10, Redmond will also be able to further

    push more and more people to Linux.

    Last weekend my elderly (as in early 70's) Uncle brought his desktop down for some H8 fixing, and he brought a spare laptop to try Linux on as well (older Tosh that ran Vista in it's heyday). He wanted data recovered from the machine first.

    5 mins after installing Mint on the laptop he was asking if it could be put on the desktop as well. I told him to try it for a few weeks first.

    Instead I spent my easter Monday making a backup (so nice of MS to improve the backup tools in 8.1 and later... Oh wait no, the got rid of the no-frills but functional backup tools that came with 7! Everyone must use MS's fogcloud, can't do a bare-metal backup anymore!) of his system (7 (yes, seven partitions on the Acer machine, one of which was the typical 50% of HDD "Data" partition few users ever knew how to use, but kudos to Acer for trying to get people to segregate data and OS), then a little bit installing Linux. And a while trying to be sure that windows wasn't hibernating (even with "fast boot" and other related options turned off... FUCK YOU MS! That shit just makes things harder!), then a quick bit importing docs and mail. He loves it, and has said he finds it much easier to use than Windoze. And of course I find it much much much much much much much much easier to fix, especially with my limited home bandwidth.

    So thanks MS. Your wonderful treatment of users has just added another Linux convert, and just made my support life much easier. No more registry shit, no more malware, easy reliable updates that take seconds to detect and at most a few minutes to install, seldom a restart (only for some really core bits of the OS, not for a minor change to a fucking browser you numpties!). One more convert, lot less stress. Keep up the good work MS!

  21. Jonathan 27

    If you don't like Microsoft's tactics, now is the time to switch to an alternative OS, because running outdated operating systems just gets harder and harder.

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I actually kind of miss Steve Ballmer now

    He wouldn't have done deplorable things like this.

    This is planned obsolescence on steroids.

  23. TPX

    I picture it this way, there is a committee of insensitive Nazi-like people sitting around a big table in Redmond ignoring everything that has made people loyal to Microsoft. They just want to push their bloated, clown colored Windows 10 on people who have no use for all the bloat. Those people also don't want to be tracked with every move they make. Microsoft does not have the right to take control of the computer I buy with my money! If they want to send me a computer with their software on it gratis, then that's a different story. There must be consumer laws enacted to protect the consumer from these behemoth computer companies going all Darth Vader on us. This is why a I bought a computer that will have nothing but linux on it ....... and slowly I will get out of the clutches of the Microsoft oligarchy to have some control of what goes in with things that I pay money for in my own home.

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