back to article Virgin Atlantic co-pilot dazzled by laser

A Virgin Atlantic flight from Heathrow to New York was forced to return to London yesterday after the co-pilot was dazzled by a laser. The flight crew of flight VS205 declared a "Pan-Pan" emergency* shortly after 8pm as the Airbus A340 passed over the west coast of Ireland. The aircraft, carrying 252 passengers and 15 crew, …

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  1. Ed Mozley

    One way mirrors

    I have just written to Airbus and Boeing suggesting they replace Windows and wind shield in cockpit with 1 way mirror glass. Pilots can see and lasers from ground are reflected away from aircraft. Could such a plan work?!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: One way mirrors

      Pilots can see and lasers from ground are reflected away from aircraft

      You want glass that prevents light from getting from the outside in, and still think the pilot will be able to see out??

      1. Ed Mozley

        Re: One way mirrors

        The kind of glass that you have in a police line up - not that I've ever been in one ha!

        1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

          Re: One way mirrors

          "The kind of glass that you have in a police line up - not that I've ever been in one ha!"

          It works by splitting the light, some reflected, some transmitted. If the witness is watching from a darkened room there's little light coming through and it's easily swamped by the reflected light from the room where the line-up is taking place. Inside the viewing room there's little light being reflected back so it doesn't interfere with the light from the viewing room.

          There's nothing "one way" about it, it's just a coating that reflects some but not all light. If both sides of the mirror are well lit each side will see a dim reflection and a dim transmitted image.

      2. Ed Mozley

        Re: One way mirrors

        Hang in you're right.... Not thought it through!!

    2. Stoneshop

      Re: One way mirrors

      I have just written to Airbus and Boeing suggesting they replace Windows

      Most of the stuff in the cockpit nowadays is either based on Linux, or embedded. But it was a useful suggestion anyway.

    3. 27escape
      Happy

      Re: One way mirrors

      I thought pilots all wore 'cool' mirrored sunglasses anyway

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: One way mirrors

      Mirror glass works on the fact that glass + dark background is already reflective and then adds some reflective material. Fitting that to a cockpit would mean having to keep it darker than the outside, which is a challenge if you fly at night with luminous instruments.

      I think the welding hood glass idea is better, provided a reliable way can be worked out to pick up a laser beam from any angle to ensure it triggers. That system is not only fast, it also demands next to nothing in power so it's easy to make the power supply for it redundant and pilots are already no longer wearing polarised sunglasses because of the LCD instruments.

      I would personally favour launching a small laser guided missile, but you can never depend on idiots to keep the thing lit long enough. I'm not worried about hitting someone else, thanks to the US we can now just call it collateral damage and then it's all OK. Besides, it may encourage others to stop idiots using lasers on planes for sheer self preservation. Winners all around...

  2. Kevin (Just Kevin)
    Facepalm

    Units of measurement

    "more than 8998"? Seriously?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      tiptoeing past

      It's over 9000!

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    'Ray-Bans'

    BAN, BAN, BAN ,BAN, BAN, BAN, BAN, BAN........JUST BAN BREATHING....PROBLEM SOLVED!

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Filters...

    http://www.metamaterial.com/lamdaguard

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Filters...

      I would want to see that demonstrated before I believe it. The industry is replete with people who offer "solutions" which are anything but, the most egregious one IMHO the IED detector made from a golf ball seeker.

  5. John Geek
    Boffin

    i've got a couple fairly high power chinese green laser pointers. comparing them with an older one that I know is just about 4mW, I'd estimate these powerful ones to be in the 50mW range.... their beam is NOT very well collimated. it might be 1mm wide at the exit, but its about 15mm wide at a distance of 12 meters. at 2500 meters (8000 feet), it would be 3 meters across, which hugely reduces the brigthness of the beam. To hit the cockpit of a plane flying at 2500 meters, you'd have to be shining them from even farther away (straight up would hit the underside of the jet, not the cockpit), so the beam would be even more diffused.

  6. LunarTick

    Simple and cheap solution

    Just install some window blinds ffs...

    1. gazthejourno (Written by Reg staff)

      Re: Simple and cheap solution

      You want your pilots to be blind while trying to land?

      Remind me never to get aboard an aircraft with you.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Simple and cheap solution

        It must have been quite late for you to have missed the whooshing sound. As far as I can tell that was a joke :)

  7. Triggerfish

    Eagles

    Come on surely we can train drone hunting eagles to hone in on laser beams. 4Kg of Golden Eagle talons out diving towards you at 150mph, could be an effective detterent.

  8. David Roberts
    Black Helicopters

    However in the real world......

    All those happy people who are enthusiastic about permanent injury and death for idiots waving laser pointers might first like to test the practicality on those convicted of gun and knife crime. Of course this might make the UK seem slightly uncivilised.

    Firing back down the laser beam sounds just and proportianate until of course some knob leaves a fixed laser behind taped to the roof of a hospital, just for a laugh.

    Main reality check, however; if there isn't the personpower to investigate burglaries, there are no police on the beat and precious few on the roads, the police are not effective despite clear legislation at preventing the possession of firearms and knives then how effective is new legislation likely to be?

    Stick the airports out in the sticks where there is cleared land (or sea) all around and simple security measures can spot intruders and you might be able to protect incoming and outgoing flights from attack.

    Leaving airports in the middle of built up areas makes effective policing impossible even if you increased the personpower by 10 times. You would need regular vehicle and foot patrols, stop and search, free entry to any premises, constant overhead patrols and more. Police state on steroids.

    TL;DR legislation is very rarely the answer. Enforce existing legislation effectively before you add more.

    1. Adrian 4

      Re: However in the real world......

      Doesn't the backscatter give the pointer away ?

      Mount a set of cameras covering the airport with a field of view wide enough to cover the risk zone (about 10 miles, so maybe the cameras 10 miles or so from the airport). Filter them so they don't see much apart from common laser wavelengths like 532nm. Trigger when two or more cameras see a line simultaneously and calculate where the line starts. You get a lot of readings - multiple video frames and multiple pixels, so good accuracy without a stupidly high resolution camera. Probably multiple events too.

    2. Fred Flintstone Gold badge

      Re: However in the real world......

      Main reality check, however; if there isn't the personpower to investigate burglaries, there are no police on the beat and precious few on the roads, the police are not effective despite clear legislation at preventing the possession of firearms and knives then how effective is new legislation likely to be?

      Good point. It would suck if you were on the plane with the uneven ID..

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