back to article The award for worst ISP goes to... it starts with Talk and ends with Talk

Beleaguered ISP TalkTalk has once again been named worst UK internet provider in a biannual survey of providers by consumer charity Which? For the fifth time the provider has come out as worst Brit ISP in a poll of 1,700 customers, raking in a satisfaction score of just 40 per cent. Users said slow speeds, frequent connection …

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    1. MonkeyCee

      Zen

      "But... who was the best ISP?"

      Zen :)

      Well, I'm sure there are others, but they've been great whenever I've dealt with them, and they've managed to do that for a few years now.

      If Openreach is being a dick, you're still pretty screwed.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Zen

        Cannot praise Zen highly enough. After a succession of bad experiences with Sky & Orange/EE, I have been with them for home ISP for just over a year now. You pay a premium but, boy, is it worth it.

        When you call support you get straight through to someone who actually understands what they are talking about, isn't just working from a script, and is able to deal with issues immediately.

        Compare this to, for example, a problem I had when my ISP was EE where over a period of more than a year they failed to fix an issue despite multiple calls and promises to phone me back (they never did) and promises that it would be fixed in a few days (it wasn't).

        At work we've used AAISP for 15 years and they are also fantastic. Rock solid reliability and technical and/or financial issues sorted out immediately and correctly.

      2. CrazyOldCatMan Silver badge

        Re: Zen

        Indeed. I've been with Zen for a couple of years now. A pleasure to deal with (as were idnet, their predecesseors - but there was a considerable price difference for the same service).

        Good customer services, actual techies you can talk to "clickety, clickety, ah yes - I can see the problem. It'll work now" rather than script-reading muppets who have neither the knowledge, ability or power to do anything other than log a call..

        1. MonkeyCee

          Re: Zen

          Yeah, that was experience of Zen. You're paying "extra" so that anyone answering your phone or email is an actual tech rather than customer service drone.

          1. EvadingGrid

            Re: Zen

            Zen's Tech support is very good.

            They will lift the block on the e-mail port if you ask.

            They do not force you to use an insecure e-mail server, like say Sky

            They will give you a static ip if you ask.

            They do not think running apache at home is a semi-crimminal act. If you read the small print on the big name ISP, they restrict ports and services.

        2. TonyJ

          Re: Zen

          See now I had the exact opposite with Zen.

          I moved my ADSL as it was then from O2 business to Zen business.

          It went from my already poor 4.5Mbits to c56kbps and was truly dreadful.

          After a week of being onto them with them basically repeatedly telling me it was fine despite screenshots showing the problems I ended up having to cancel and moved to BeThere who were another superb ISP.

          Interestingly they never provided fibre or any kind and when I called for my MAK they offered me two years free...that was literally about three weeks before they announced the Sky buy so I guess that was why.

          Still remember how chilled the guy on the call was about my leaving. Having explained that I was getting fibre and they simply didn't do it or have any plans to he took a big deep breath and said "you'd be crazy to accept this man but if you want we will give you two free years...but go get your fibre" :)

  1. schmerg

    What Which? are you reading?

    Opens this months Which? (Oct 2017) to page 42 "TV & Broadband Providers"...

    TalkTalk are mid-table with "customer score" of 51% (behind PlusNet & EE, ahead of BT & Sky, neck & next with Virgin but rated higher overall).

    Maybe they've also done another survey, but as this is out in the same months magazine, and it's a 4 page article, is it perhaps worth mentioning?

    [ Disclaimer - single anecdote is not authoritative but ~10 years with TalkTalk, esp. on Fibre, much happier with TT than other ISPs when I had a troublesome physical line which was really OpenReach's problem. IMHO TT get a lot of the "cheap end" of customers who are less able to understand the physical limits of ADSL. If you're a long way from the exchange you won't get a magical data rate from any ISP. And this is the source of quite a number (not all) of complaints. The user forums frequented by their UK based tech staff are very helpful and let me mostly bypass phone support ].

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Does anyone use Talk Talk Business Leased Lines?

    I'd be interested to know how you found them as apparently they are a different group to Talk Talk consumer, UK only call centres and better customer service.

    I find BT business useless, with very strange ideas about SIP and would look to change.

    1. noboard

      Re: Does anyone use Talk Talk Business Leased Lines?

      I'm pretty sure Zen are using them, that's what it said on my account last time I logged into the Zen portal. This was a few months ago and I've not had any issues. Only had one issue with Zen in 5+ years and it was sorted quickly.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Does anyone use Talk Talk Business Leased Lines?

      We did. And we don't any more. For lots of reasons.

      They are better than TT consumer, but only just. The best thing you can say about them is that they are better than vermin media.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Does anyone use Talk Talk Business Leased Lines?

      Shit.

      Had them for short period.

      No more.

      But then again, most will say "We can ping it" or "must be customers equipment".

      My experience is you just pick your level of shit service required and choose that carrier.

  3. Norman Nescio Silver badge

    AAISP vs. TalkTalk

    I migrated from TalkTalk Business to AAISP.

    TalkTalk: line goodput varied from ok to a very, very small fraction of the DSL sync speed. The final straw (after putting up with slow downloads for years*) was trying to download a software update for some kit that repeatedly dropped to a throughput of 0 (yes, zero) kbit/s** (and it was not the server - swapping to my neighbour's WiFi (with the neighbour's permission) and their BT Internet connection on the same exchange worked with no problem).

    AAISP: same kit, same copper, same exchange, absolutely no problems whatsoever, downloads at the maximum the DSL sync speed will allow.

    It helps that AAISP have orders-of-magnitude better customer service. Talking to clueful people on the phone is a joy - I can even call them on VoIP. Yes, they are more expensive, but they show how things can (and should) be done.

    I do have a couple of very, very minor niggles with AAISP - but compared with TalkTalk (and Hyperoptic) they are paragons of competence and cluefulness.

    *The saga of my dealings with TalkTalk customer service would fill too many screens - you would wear out the scroll-wheel on your mouse/PgDn key getting to the end - if you didn't lose the will to live first. I feel very fortunate to have got away from them with them owing me a small sum that I can't summon up the will to chase.

    **I suspect some 'intelligent' throttling that allowed an initial burst at a good rate, but then screwed things down. It wasn't a WiFi issue as my laptop's connection was hard-wired - I used WiFi only to connect to the neighbour. And, of course, speed testing sites worked fine.

  4. Jean Le PHARMACIEN

    Only complainers make a noise

    See title.

    I was with UKLinux.net (Entanet reseller -> BT Openreach) via FTTC and then copper to my (overhead cable) house - about 150m copper (and it is ALL copper apparently from BT guy in the hole).

    Only got 38Mb but have to say it was very reliable (from my SamKnows box info)

    Went to EE (I know they are part of BT now) and got a bundled reduction in home BB (already had mobile with them)

    Big cock-up on changeover as BT Wholesale hadn't done paperwork properly years before and said I was still with Entanet. Took 2 months to sort (EE very helpful and informative - gave me 12 gb/mnth to use my 4G phone as internet connection whilst sorted)

    End result: now get 48mb+ (still good and reliable) - only downside is the old cable /connections to exchange (less than 1.5 miles).

    OK not greatest. But it works *reliably* month on month speedwise and connection. Reliability is all for me. Don't do streaming of TV/Video/Facetwat YMMV

    If you are happy with service level; you don't post and nobody knows..

    [FFS why have 8 million concurrent downloads of Eastenders clogging interwebs when they could record on their Mythbox over FTA Freeview and watch later. Sheesh]

  5. Craigie

    YakYak

    TalkTalk do not exist except as the faint miasma between the contractors that provide their 'service'.

  6. Steve Cooper

    Skie

    I have never had a problem with Sky (ADSL then fibre) on 3 properties over the last 8 or so years. I've never met anyone who has a problem with Sky broadband either.

    1. The Dogs Meevonks Silver badge

      Re: Skie

      I've had problems with Sky, like the constant drop outs every night around 12-2am, the utter POS router that can't do 5ghz wifi or gigabit lan and can barely do 2.4ghz wifi at all... Can't get a reliable or stable signal if you move further than 5-6m away from the router.

      Contract was up so I called for a better deal... spoke with a drone who was rude and uninterested... didn't give a crap that I'd been a customer at this address for almost 8yrs and a previous address for 7yrs. Told them what I could get elsewhere and didn't care... So I switched to VM and am saving £15 a month whilst getting a 100mbps connection instead of less than 40mbps... their router may not be perfect but it's a 100 times better than the Sky POS.

      But the worst parts was Sky trying to charge me after I had already left... Cue complaints and disputes to them regarding their actions... they failed to deal with the complaint, failed to send me an accurate bill and passed details to a debt collection agency which they cannot do when an account is in dispute. Ignore all contact from DCA and made complaint to both offcom and ICO.

      VM on the other hand have resolved all of the issues... They failed to give me the same package as I had with Sky, resolved at their expense, engineer damaged some skirting whilst fitting the new box... resolved and compensated.

      When current contract with VM is up next April, I'll look around for better deals again... I think switching each year is the way to go, I don't use any TV services as I have netflix & prime and FVHD and can pretty much watch anything I want at any time... So why pay for a bunch of channels I neither need or watch.

      1. VooDooTooDo

        Re: Skie

        Strange that my SKY router performs Gigabit LAN & 5GHz WiFi just nicely! Even with the older routers I had no problems with WiFi service around the house, down the garden, in the loft, on the road outside house, etc.

        I always find that SKY will speak to you in the same manner that you speak to them. Treat them nicely & they will treat you nicely & sort you out with good incentives & discounts.

    2. egbert

      Re: Skie

      Moved to Sky ten years ago. Old broadband (Wannadoo) got cut off, New Sky router wouldn't connect. Called support. Offshore call centre - crappy line quality. "Just be patient, it sometimes takes a while". 24 hours later, still no service. Call support again - made to go through the dreaded script - "Is the router plugged in to the mains?...". Still not working. Told to wait another 24 hours.

      Downloaded hack from internet (by dialing up my work and using their broadband) that allowed me to see the PPP username/password (Sky hid it from users in those days) and used that to setup another router/modem. Still didn't work.

      After about 4 days of this, phoned their sales team and told them I was cancelling unless they sorted it out immediately. They gave me a number to call.

      Called the number. Scottish voice "Hello?". There then followed 30 seconds of brisk "Have you tried X, have you tried Y?,..." followed by "It's a line fault, I'll get an engineer out".

      Service working next day.

      Call centre following a script 0/10

      Eventual person who actually knew what they were doing 10/10

    3. Dave Lawton
      FAIL

      Re: Skie

      Pie in the sky more like (sorry Richard).

      Friend of mine moved into an area where Virgin was not available.

      She ignored my advice about not choosing sky...

      Telephone socket already fitted.

      Sky wanted 200GBP upfront to supply service.

      Order placed 30 July.

      Installation date 30 August.

      30 August Sky guy fits dish & q-box, doesn't mention q-box won't work properly without BB, says he can't do anything with the BB, and leaves.

      6 September BTOR guy says can't fix, need Cherry Picker because pole is dangerous.

      13 September I arrive, ring Sky, told no action from them until 25 September.

      Threats of cancellation produce promise of action on 19 September.

      19 September Cherry Picker arrives, complete new box+cables to pole installed.

      20 September told underground fault, can't fix until 25 September.

      Will not need further access.

      20 September Sky promises refunds+free service but still takes DD.

      Update on Monday.

      Lord only knows what would have happened if she had asked for fibre.

      Meanwhile still no phone line for emergency service access, and yes, they were told.

    4. EvadingGrid

      Re: Skie

      Sky . . . .

      Its not a full and complete internet connection, they block ports, shape traffic, and decide what you can or can not do with your internet connection.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    This does miss a question out....

    I never had to phone BT in the 5 years I had them

    So is their customer service 100% or 0%

    1. The Dogs Meevonks Silver badge

      Re: This does miss a question out....

      The true measure of any company is what they do when things go wrong. So providing the service you pay for isn't a measurable factor really.

      So I guess that means 0% :)

  8. a_yank_lurker

    Worst in UK but not World

    Over here we have Comcrap and a couple of other unworthies that could teach TalkTalk a thing or two about being hideous.

    1. CrazyOldCatMan Silver badge

      Re: Worst in UK but not World

      At least here we (mostly) have a wide range of ISPs to chose from. The benefits of government-mandated last-mile access :-)

  9. Alperian

    ChatChat

    I have two TalkTalk accounts coming into the house in Oxfordshire. Have had for years. I know: silly to have two lines by the same supplier (uh-huk-uh-huk). However, the only problem we have had is with one of the accounts is that my business caller ID has never worked. I checked in my online account meaning to make sure that it was turned on and it said that it was.

    Long and short of it, saw this article, decided to give TT a hard time about it at last. Got straight through - I mean straight through after the menus. Turns out it was turned off all the time. Bish bash bosh turned it on. Now I don't have anything to gripe about which my missus would disagree with.

  10. Andy Non Silver badge
    Meh

    I'm fed up of being pestered by

    dodgy looking women soliciting on street corners. They smile sweetly and ask "Hey mister, would you like TalkTalk broadband."

  11. FuzzyWuzzys

    "Users said slow speeds, frequent connection drop-outs and poor customer service as their biggest bugbears with the provider."

    Sadly as Virgin pushes their monster speeds up and up, they're going the same way. My service used to be brilliant but lately it's just falling apart, drop outs at least 3-4 times a day for 2-3 mins.

  12. dmacleo

    yeah....try this ISP

    I see author(s) never used tdstelecom in the US.

    its ONLY broadband in my town (rural area) and I am lucky to to get 7MBps during day and 128 KBps (yes isdn speeds) at night.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: yeah....try this ISP

      You might have you B's and your b's mixed up. 7MB = 56Mb, which is quite good.

      (line speeds are always quoted in b (bits), and not B (bytes); 1B = 8b

      1. dmacleo

        Re: yeah....try this ISP

        yeah I constantly do that, sorry.

        arthritis issues.

  13. roger 8

    virgin

    Ive been with virgin over 20 years now. from when they where diamond cable. even when i worked for BT. when broadband first came out. i was working for BT. had a chat with an engineer about having it at home.was told don't bother go with diamond media as most of our main cables back to the exchange are still the original wires laid down in the beginning of the GPO. I then went to work for then called NTL.

    did my own install in my present house 16 years ago. barring 1 tv box failing an a power supply for the modem. Ive not had any network issues. Always had the speeds i've paid for. I even remember when people where leaving NTL for AOL broadband and i would turn up with an AOL broadband modem. SAME as NTL but different sticker. no cable changes whatsoever. just plug in and use install CD. My lad worked for BT and now sky so i keep updated on offers and kit. For me Its just not worth me changing.

    where i am. Because anything over the bt network. will be useless. I would be better firing up my ham radio packet bbs at 1200 baud i would get faster speeds.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    There's a certain inevitability about this

    It's like Meryl Streep winning 'Best Actress'.

    The only difference is that Meryl has never tried to communicate with an Indian accent.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Speaking of TalkTalk

    (since it is past the watershed)

    Does anyone know the outcome of the hacking case at the Old Bailey? I saw two people had been convicted in April, but never saw anything about how long they were sent down for.

  16. Dominion

    They’re all rubbish!

    Had BT, Sky and now Utility Warehouse, all via BT / Openreach. Sky - router was crap. BT - incompetent billing department - the bills were a confusing mess of services being charged and refunded each month, sometimes over several months due to being billed quarterly. Ended up shouting at them because having left them they insisted I still needed a direct debit for BT Sport, even though I’d never asked for it, never watched it and it was added to my account without my consent - charged each month and then refunded. Utility Warehouse are ok, but speeds not great. No option of cable round here so ultimately stuck with a service ending up with BT, but I will never, ever pay BT directly again. I’d sooner not have an internet connection than deal with vermin like them.

    1. This post has been deleted by its author

  17. This post has been deleted by its author

  18. DaveMellor

    Average speed of 16+ MBits - in my dreams.

    Says a customer with EE!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      "DaveMellor

      Average speed of 16+ Mbits - in my dreams.

      Says a customer with EE!"

      There, fixed that embarrassing mistake for you.

  19. Jason Hindle

    The main issue, in my experience....

    Sure, you BT Home Hub, YakYak or Sky broadband router might be working incredibly well, but you've no guarantee a problem will be resolved in any reasonable amount of time. Problems with the router, and out to the cabinet, should be easy enough to deal with, but the simplest way to deal with a core/edge network issue may well be to move provider! I've read enough horror stories of BT customers going long without service, and have my own bad experience with TalkTalk*. I have BT Infinity 2, at the moment, and (fingers/toes crossed) it works very nicely. I don't have time for a Kafkaesque customer service experience.

    * Couldn't receive calls at home. They charged me for an inconclusive home visit, and the problem mysteriously fixed itself after a few days.

  20. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Yep...and their 'wholesale' offering isn't any better

    I have to work with them for part of my employers wholesale offering. Trying to get them to perform critical changes takes weeks with days between updates. Often they'll ask the same question several times in different ways until finally accepting what you told them in the first place. Extremely frustrating.

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Not surprised...

    Esp. when I'm paying these clowns £22.31/month for half a Mbit down...

  22. molletts

    Given that they're the same company as far as I'm aware, I've never been able to figure out how TalkTalk can be so consistently rubbish while Utility Warehouse, equally consistently, manage to fare pretty well.

  23. Slx

    It just shows what a catchy name and good advertising can do for you!

  24. anthonyhegedus Silver badge

    My company supplies broadband through ICUK. We can choose whether a circuit goes through TalkTalk's network or BT's. Of course both use the same Openreach physical infrastructure. All I can say is:

    - Talktalk's network lets us have more control of ADSL connections (e.g. Target SNR)

    - Talktalk's network is unmetered

    - Talktalk's network is much cheaper

    - BT's network has little control of anything

    - BT's network is metered

    - BT's network is more expensive

    As for reliability, there's not a lot in in. I'd say Talktalk's is slightly more reliable. Usually when there's a problem, it's between the customer and the exchange, and whether it's BT or Talktalk, the procedure is just as painful. The quality of the service depends on whether the service level we have, and it tends to be better with talktalk as our package includes 'premium' repairs. However, it mainly depends on whether or not the phone line is provided through us, or a third party. If it's us, it means we can do more diagnostics ourselves and are not at the beck and call of some god-awful phone company who don't listen to their customers.

    Overall, it's pretty dire. The sooner Openreach is shaken up and actually provides a good all-round service, the better. We have customers on industrial estates where they can barely get 3mbps (and at one, the contract says they have to use the estate's own expensive slow service, at another, they were persuaded to go for true 'fibre' that's shared with the whole estate, and guess what? they get 3mbps but are paying £100 a month for it!), we have customers in rural areas who need proper service and despite having 3 adsl circuits, still struggle. We have customers in cities who can't get more than 0.5mbps. There's nothing we can do, there's no alternative in most cases, and we have to wait years in some cases to get decent service.

    Actually one interesting case was in Wales, near Llandudno, where it took 6 months to get 3 phone lines in. The broadband needed to be supplemented by satellite as it was only 0.5mbps. Then suddenly, we were able to provide full FTTP. That took three months to get installed and running, but it's very expensive, at over £200 a month for 330mbps. They could then get rid of their three phone lines, and use voip. It's the only site out of 50 or so that we provide where we can get FTTP.

    So only one out of our 50 sites can get FTTP, and it's too expensive to use at it's 'full' speed of 330mbps. I'm not impressed.

  25. Old Lady

    Sky absolute rubbish

    I am in my mid-seventies, every time, which is frequently, I get the same old script "Have you changed the filter" then spend 5 mins explaining I have an I-Plate. Then I am told to get out my screwdriver & take the cover off. I explain that I am not able to lie flat on my stomach unscrewing something I was told by BT not to touch. Then they tell me they can't help if I can't take the plate off. I ask am I the only disabled customer, no answer. I feel like reporting them for discrimination. The line is noisy I can hardly hear on what must be my incoming line because people tell me the can hear me OK. So I get "Have you tried a different telephone" They try anything other than to get BT to look at the line. The problem started when O2 sold us down the river. I also have Sky TV & if it wasn't for my sick husband liking the film channel I would tell them where to stick their TV, broadband & telephone service. The laugh is I have to download a film overnight because it takes all night to download it. It took me an hour to update 6 Apps on my iPod this morning. Wish someone would ask me to score Sky it would be zero out of ten.

  26. ps2os2

    WORST ISP ... Not even close it is COMCAST

    I called up support people about people were sending me emails, and they were bouncing as according to COMCAST email servers I didn't exist.

    I talked to one support person who passed me off to another. I finally put my foot down and told the person I want to talk to a manager.

    The manager gets on the line and tells me he will have it fixed by next day.

    Next day I get a call from a telephone person saying that the birds are causing the problem and he has some magical spray that will put an end to that. I rolled my eyes and told him to go for it.

    I saw him spraying. Next day I called up and informed them the issue was not resolved. I told them I want a server person that could explain the issue. I was told I couldn't talk to them. I said OK, how about canceling my service.

    Next day the problem was fixed.

    That is the worst ISP.

  27. ps2os2

    COMCAST is the WORST ISP PERIOD

    I called up support people about people were sending me emails, and they were bouncing as according to COMCAST email servers I didn't exist.

    I talked to one support person who passed me off to another. I finally put my foot down and told the person I want to talk to a manager.

    The manager gets on the line and tells me he will have it fixed by next day.

    Next day I get a call from a telephone person saying that the birds are causing the problem and he has some magical spray that will put an end to that. I rolled my eyes and told him to go for it.

    I saw him spraying. Next day I called up and informed them the issue was not resolved. I told them I want a server person that could explain the issue. I was told I couldn't talk to them. I said OK, how about canceling my service.

    Next day the problem was fixed.

  28. hoola Silver badge

    OpenReach

    My experience of PlusNet/OpenReach has only been good. The fibre connecting at around 65MB started to drop out. Finally contacted PlusNet support (now there is a challenge, phone only so pick your time otherwise you hang one for hours). Usual guff about the router, cabling etc (they could tell I was not using their Technicolor piece of crap) and the engineer rings the next day to check if anyone was in. He then spent 3 hours between the cabinet/exchange/house sorting out water in the manhole in the road and a faulty switch port at the exchange. He also replaced the internal master socket "just to be safe". It now connects at 70MB down and 20MB up on an FritzBox router.

    My only complaint is the lunacy of PlusNet's call system, why you cannot open a ticket online just is beyond me.

    Similarly BT/OpenReach recently had to replace an entire cabinet because some plonker parked their car on it, wiping out phone & broadband for quite a few houses. Within 6 hours phone was restored along with dodgy broadband. We all new the broadband was a bodge but 3 days later a completely new cabinet goes in and it is fixed.

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