"...or happened to be female"
Presumably, if they already have a sample to compare with, they must already know that it was a man. It is quite simple to tell whether a suitable DNA sample comes from either a man or a woman by the presence or absence of a Y chromosome.
Flame warning - Of course, if there was already a national DNA register......
if there *were* already...
you and your fancy ideas are nicked
Not as simple as you think
Y chromosomes can come from people classified as women, if they've undergone an official gender change, or have one of the various genetic diseases that can cause XYs to present as female (look up Swyer syndrome, for instance).
Yes it bloody well IS an invasion of privacy, and a spendy and gratuitous one.
Yes, why not just squander the privacy of every male in the city on the assumption one of them must be the killer. That's all adults, of course. And what about all teenagers? Hm? Where did she intend to stop? I think she had to lie down a bit after thinking all that, so she didn't get to the thinking it through part. But no matter, she's labour, so no need for all that. Equality for all means no privacy for all, it's as simple as that and that's all there is to it.
Of course, /she/ won't have to submit for her DNA to be taken and stored in some database and then kept until probably forever, unless the backups get lost on a bus or something. Happy to be a woman and vindicative about it, eh?
Vindictive women ...
... find the Labour Party very attractive, it seems. They seem to think red rosettes suit them.
So, they assume the guy lives in the area.
Then they assume he hasn't moved away already.
Then they assume he won't move away as soon as the public request for DNA is made.
And they assume he would gladly give his DNA when asked nicely.
Sounds like an MP looking for a little press coverage.
Someone that demonstrably stupid really shouldn't be allowed near public office.
Resign me thinks.
A Labour production
Just think for a minute, this is the party created a government that wanted all you details in a database. So no surprises that they want DNA samples of person.
Why do people like Kerry McCarthy get away with this bollocks?
Please, please, someone publicly humiliate this woman by picking holes in her idea so people who should know better keep their mouths shut rather than mislead the public into thinking they have a magic answer.
How can you humiliate somebody with no humility?
Felix Would Certainly Approve This
Flame burning Fiches.
Felix - dunno, but Lavrentij Pavlovich - definitely
Felix may have shot people by the thousands in the back of their heads in the basement on Lubjanka, but he never ever tried to keep tabs on the entire country and have a file on every living (and dead) person in USSR.
You are mistaking him for the person who was the real driving force behind the pervasive control society we nowdays erroneously call "communism": Lavrentij Pavolovich Beria (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beria). Compared to him Iron Felix is a boy-scout.
Surely they would just....
get a massive sample of people which wouldn't actually help as only 'innocent'/'willing' people would come forward to help.
Unless I'm missing something?
Paris - She is confused too.
Re: Surely they would just
You might think you are innocent but if you happened to be walking past the victim and sneezed rather violently, let's say due to a bad cold, then went home alone to rest would be able to prove you didn't kill her. After all they now have your DNA on the victim so you must be guilty.
As people said ...
given the form plod have, without explicit guarantees, I would suspect they would simply add any volunteered samples to the NDNAD. Also, given UK plods quietly growing habit of using familial DNA matches (for christs sake, just hope no one in your family commits a serious crime - you'll be harrassed from here to doomsday).
family you know of, that is. It could always be an illegitamate sibling your Dad never knew of.
This means the killer is not a sex offender or related to any other criminal. 5 million people can be ruled out or most of the 16-34 year old male population.
Therefore it is elementary the killer is a female aged over 34.
What coppers think
Who cares what the police think. They are there to serve not tell everyone else whether it is a good idea or not. Their opinion is irrelevant. We do not live in a police state.
As for the MP he is just another one of those dumb idiots who wants everyone and everything that moves or breathes on a coppers database.
He can get stuffed.
Operand Type Mismatch more like. 'He' is a she.
@ We do not live in a police state
According to all the evidence I've seen lately (& especial hanks to our beloved Reg hacks for their diligence in documenting much of it), WE DO. We may wish it weren't so, but that's the fact of the matter, so stop living in denial
Omen est nomen?! The new McCarthy era... You couldn't make it up, could you?
Let's get this into perspective
It's ONE murder
Maybe one too many bit nonetheless it's still only one that's been hyped up out of all proportion by the press.
Media wise this has many similarities with the US Lacey Peterson and Aruba Natalee Holloway cases in that a good looking young middle class white girl went missing. This sort of reporting doesn't happen for other victim types.
At least while the press are obsessed with this we are safe from terrorist threats.
Thought that hype came mostly from the government even if the press was and is more than a little accommodating, but I digress into clearly unimportant tangents here.
So we'll just sacrifice Bristol's male population's dna profiles on the altar of yet another plod-run database to keep the press from hyping up terrorism? Is that it? My, I never... a labour MP girl coming up with an actual cunning plan!
I've got a little list...
I don't think recall of MPs is part of the legal system yet... but when the law is passed perhaps we will see fewer MPs making arses of themselves.
Kerry McCarthy, Labour MP for Bristol East seems to have offended half her constituents already.
its been done before
OK, fingerprints back then but this was still at bleeding edge of tech back then. Also note it was of people "Known" to have been in the area at the time not those there at the time of the test.
MP For Bristol East, eh?
Surely, as a resident of Bristol, she's aware that Clifton isn't even in her electoral ward, being in Bristol West. Perhaps she should just fuck off back to her side of the M32 and shut the fuck up?
Even out of Government Labour are still trying to build a national DNA database of everyone by the back door. Obviously we are all potential criminals.
Clearly this MP knows who the murderer is because she only wants to DNA test men.
Women never commit crime. Ever. They never murder people. Get in fights. Or molest children. So no need to consider anyone but men. Men, Men, Men.
She either has an irrational hatred of men or isn't getting enough (votes)
I refer you to the more rational comments in this thread, and suggest that if you went to the cops with this angle they'd do you for wasting their time.
Sexism does not exist everywhere and in all things. Please.
Not an irrational hatred of men.
maybe an unnatural love of women ?
Re: The Worm that Turned
It may be statistically unlikely that a woman is the murderer, but it's also statistically very unlikely to be any given man in Bristol either.
I thought we learnt about the perils of picking on and rounding up specific demographics over the last few centuries? Obviously not.
As noted above
Be a bit of a bugger if a woman had killed her wouldn't it? Unlikely, but these things do happen.
Police and politicians..
Maybe the police have evidence that the killer was male. Does Ms McCarthy? Chances are she doesn't have a full brief in this, and isn't completely privy to the investigation.
So, she makes the assumption it's male (chances are that it is, but hey, discounting women is sexist. You know, that thing that Labour keep chanting about being completely evil. Unless of course, it's used as a weapon against a man, in which case it's fine, because men are inherently evil).
This hypocritical stance, with absolutely no idea of ethics, science, cost or anything remotely useful really just makes me wonder how on earth anyone like that gets elected.. Well, apart from the fact she's Labour, and in Bristol (I swear, you could get an amoeba voted in on the Labour ticket in some areas of Bristol, and I'd rather that than her).
>how the fuck is it possible for someone that stupid to get elected in this country?
She wasn't elected, she was selected by "Community Leaders" who deliver blocks of votes to whomever promises them the best housing deals for their cousins and wives (with lots of overlap) straight off the plane.
Kerry has basically brought the democratic process of downtown Mogadishu to Bradford. Can't fault her for her cultural inclusivity.
Bristol =/= Bradford.
on a related point....
"A lot of people are worried about this person still being on the streets in Bristol and it is important they are caught as soon as possible.
why what did THEY do?
when i nod my head you hit it etc etc
How about a compromise... I'll allow this Catholic Church person to take a sample of the sacred DNA God gave me, if they allow me to spill my seed 'unnecessarily' from time to time?
Re: Catholic Church
Oh, and cloak my bishop's staff in a latex frock whilst spilling it.
Do we have a deal?
There is Hope!
Nice to see at least one police officer suggesting the use of common sense, rather than imediately leaping at the chance offered by the MP to fingerpint, DNA test, tag and monitor everybody in sight.
Kind of renews my previously flagging faith in our police forces.
You've been fired, you are not allowed back in the boardroom
"A persistent history of foot-dragging or outright refusal by police to destroy samples that non-suspects were told would be removed at the end of an investigation... means that the chances of everyone meekly turning up at their local station to "help police with their inquiries" is now much diminished."
Was it 30,000 volunteers for the Id Card? Which is what, about 0.05% of the population? On that basis you'd probably be looking at around 100+ Bristolian chumps ready to step forward and do their duty. Well it's a start...
Erm, anyone else notice this bit...
"Testing the best part of a quarter of a million suspects would be a massive investment of time and resources, and a complete waste of both if the perpetrator either lived just outside the target area or happened to be female."
Since when are women not capable of murder?
The police really are crap these days
Re: Erm, anyone else notice this bit...
Run! Run, run, run away.
"Kerry McCarthy, Labour MP for Bristol East "
related to Senator McCarthy, by thought if not by blood.
Presumably she has already submitted her own DNA?
Do the police even have a profile to work against?
From what has been published they dont have much evidence to work on so you have to wonder if they have any DNA for comparison anyway?
I suspect given this particular MP's track record (and criminal record!) that it was a knee jerk soundbite statement with little thought for the consequences.
That said, people of Bristol, you voted for her, you can get rid of her.
shock news. Police *decline* offer to get people to cough up their DNA.
Sadly I'm not sure people would not turn up for this. the gullibility of the UK public remains pretty near bottomless.
So, you too?
So, you in the UK also are stuck with two major pinstripe parties populated with .... I can't think of a good P word, I'll just say, utter morontards?
We here in Oz have this problem, we are slowly pumping the blue suits to the gutter but its taking a lonnnng time.... but then any evolutionary process does.
Blighty - PLEASE get rid of these idiots, PLEASE. And ring us when its safe to visit Britain again.
Prawns? Prannies? Penii? Peverse pompous pinheads? Pain-in-the-arse pisstakers?
> I can't think of a good P word
The noun you are looking for is obviously "pillocks".
Here's an interesting thing:
The murder was committed about half a mile away from my mother's house in Clifton and the body was dumped about half a mile up the road from where I used to live in Long Ashton.
Clearly, given those facts, I should be DNA tested as a potential suspect even though I live around a hundred miles away from the scene of the crime!
(AC for the obvious reasons!)
This has been done before with DNA
Leicestershire in the mid 80s, I was out of the country or else I would have been included. The DNA testing missed the guy as he got a friend to take the test instead. The caught him when the friend mouthed off. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Pitchfork.
I'm interested with what they did with all the DNA specimens...