Too mild in both cases
The punishment in both cases is nowhere near serving as a deterrent for the next lot to try the scam.
In America, tech support conmen get a mild slap. In Blighty, scammers get the book thrown at them
Two bogus technical support operations have been shut down over the past two days – but the punishment dished out highlights eyebrow-raising differences between the US and UK in how they deal with these scumbags. On Monday, the US Federal Trade Commission reached a settlement with six people accused of running a technical …
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 09:26 GMT JimmyPage
RE: Hanging has a very low rate of reoffending.
Well, if you hang the right person, that's true.
But as the Christie case shows, hang the wrong person, and you increase crime, as the real offender is still free and the police aren't looking for them ... because they hanged them.
I tend to find proponents of capital punishment rarely think things through.
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 14:08 GMT Doctor Syntax
Re: RE: Hanging has a very low rate of reoffending.
@JimmyPage
Fully agree. There's also the point that these days you'd very probably find at least one jury member dissenting on principle. Would it be acceptable to take someone's life on the basis of a majority verdict? If not what does it say about other offences where a majority verdict is accepted?
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 17:59 GMT Cynic_999
Re: RE: Hanging has a very low rate of reoffending.
Most criminals do not think there is a significant chance of being caught, so the severity of the punishment makes little difference to whether they will commit the crime or not. However, the severity of the punishment *does* affect the average severity of the crime. A shoplifter facing a small fine will probably submit to arrest. A shoplifter facing the gallows will do everything in his power to avoid capture, including murder - they have nothing whatsoever to lose.
Plus the effect of society as a whole is that human life is in general devalued, and the entire society becomes more brutal. If hanging is an appropriate punishment for theft, then using a poker to sodomize a child trying to scrump apples is letting them off lightly.
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 20:48 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: RE: Hanging has a very low rate of reoffending.
But as the Christie case shows, hang the wrong person, and you increase crime, as the real offender is still free and the police aren't looking for them ... because they hanged them.
I always thought Agatha Christie died of natural causes?
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 14:05 GMT Doctor Syntax
Re: Too mild in both cases
"I think the third offense was generally a hangman's noose"
If you couldn't afford to pay a fine nobody was counting. From Wakefield Court Rolls, 1315:
"John de Blakhoumore, taken at the suit of Roger Walgar of Almanbury, for breaking into his house at Almanbury, and stealing goods and chattels, value 10s., which goods were found in his possession and are brought into court, is asked what defence he can make for the said burglary and theft; he pleads not guilty. An inquisition...finds him guilty. He is ordered to be hanged. He has no goods."
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 10:48 GMT jmch
Re: Too mild in both cases
So, actually, US case is 0 jail time and $150k fine, UK case is 0 jail time and 9-month curfew. Lacking any further details as to any fines in the UK case, and whether either guilty plea includes recovery of frudulently obtained assets, I would say that the US case was more lenient, not less.
In both cases I would expect coplete recovery of fraudulently obtained assets, plus fines, plus a few months in the slammer. After all anyone for example hacking a bank system to earn a few millions would be sent to jail.
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 12:24 GMT joed
Re: Too mild in both cases
I'd say that US case at least resulted in a fine (while the UK defendant will wear a bracelet and wear relaxed fit jeans to cover it for 9 months). BTW, looks like US court system will be sole beneficiary - if they set the fine right, the scammer may consider the price of conducting business. Win, win (but for scammed saps).
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 12:32 GMT Antron Argaiv
Re: Too mild in both cases
If the US scum had the wherewithal to fund a large number of LLCs, set up all the phone lines, etc, they should have hit them for a lot more than a hundred K in fines.
Who am I kidding...the current US government thinks banks are over-regulated and thus, can't compete.
I'm wondering how long it's going to take for the next 2008-type crash.
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 13:44 GMT SysKoll
Re: Too mild in both cases
Darn right. The Ohio scammer got a slap on the wrist, and the UK scammer got a sternly wagged finger in his face. Oh the horror.
I fail to see what allows Mr. Thomson to be so smug about the way the UK courts dealt with that scam. It is actually even less of a deterrent than what the moronic FTC milquetoasts did.
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 12:16 GMT JimboSmith
Re: Too mild in both cases
There was a suggestion the last time I got a call in the office from one of these people that they should be forced to watch endless repeats of Loose Women*. This was deemed a cruel and unusual punishment and therefore shouldn't be used. We then came up with the idea that they should be made tech support teacher for an old peoples home for 6 months. This was reinforced by last Fridays On Call.
*We'd just got a TV license in the office for the World Cup and had switched to ITV thinking the news was on at 1pm (like the BBC) which it wasn't.
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Thursday 1st February 2018 00:57 GMT John Brown (no body)
Re: Too mild in both cases
"The punishment in both cases is nowhere near serving as a deterrent for the next lot to try the scam."
True. It seems in the US, the scammers "go large" and then end up paying large chunks of their "profits" to the government while in the UK it's on a smaller scale and the fines are also on a small scale. In neither case do the scammed get any of the cash back.
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 13:59 GMT Prst. V.Jeltz
Re: Downvoted
I guess that acronym is "European Court of Human Rights" ? If they are going to veto any death penalty suggested by anyone signed up to their rule book then dosent that mean that The US are Human Rights violators? (apart from they aint in Europe and arnt signed up) , but still , shouldnt we be looking at Americans as savages and imposing sanctions or whatever , just like some of the less reputable dominions of the middle east? or even the More Respectable ones , Like Saudi Arabia , who've been quietly disapearing people recently , fund terrorism , and have a horrific record on womens rights, In fact why are they the respectable ones ? ... oh yeah , they have lots of cash and like to buy aeroplanes. and not the nice type of aeroplanes that take you on holiday - the ones that rain down death from the skies ....
</carriedaway>
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 15:58 GMT Loyal Commenter
Re: Downvoted
You guessed wrong. It's the European Convention on Human Rights, a treaty drafted by the Council of Europe and signed in 1950, large swathes of which were written by Brits. This pre-dates the Treaty of Rome (in 1957) and thus the EEC, later EU by several years. The other 'ECHR', teh court that arbitrates over the convention is usually abbreviated to ECtHR to distinguish it, and also is not an EU body.
The signatories to the ECHR include all EU member states (it is a precondition to joining the EU), as well as several other countries, for example former Balkan states, Russia, Greenland, etc., but, as you correctly observe, not the US.
The bit concerning the death penalty is Protocol 6:
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Wednesday 31st January 2018 09:09 GMT Adam 52
Re: Tagged curfew
A mild punishment that doesn't prevent him getting an honest job.
In some cases it may have a rehabilitation benefit too because it reduces the probability of offenders associating with trouble makers or being in a position to commit opportunistic crime.
In this case we don't know from the reporting if that's relevant, but it does look like just a cheap sentencing option.
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