back to article HMS Queen Elizabeth has sprung a leak and everyone's all a-tizzy

New British aircraft carrier HMS Queen Elizabeth has sprung a leak. The warship takes on around 200 litres of water per hour thanks to a faulty propeller shaft gland packing, according to reports. The packing in question, according to The Sun, which broke the news and knocked up a graphic illustrating the problem, was rapidly …

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  1. seven of five
    Joke

    "With no planes to fly off her, we might as well sink her"?

    A natural reef will make you popular with the greens.

    1. Pen-y-gors

      Re: "With no planes to fly off her, we might as well sink her"?

      Just make sure you remove any potential pollutants first, like aircraft fuel - no, wait, they won't have any on board will they?

    2. Bill M

      Re: "With no planes to fly off her, we might as well sink her"?

      Surely an artificial reef.

      Don't think sunken aircraft carrier reefs occur naturally.

      1. 404

        Re: "With no planes to fly off her, we might as well sink her"?

        Not strictly true - there a volcano islands being formed fairly regularly that you could land planes on, that will sink back into the sea at some point and become reefs.

        Just saying...

      2. cd
        Pirate

        Re: "With no planes to fly off her, we might as well sink her"?

        They will when Capita starts building them.

      3. Kiwi
        Coat

        Re: "With no planes to fly off her, we might as well sink her"?

        Surely an artificial reef.

        Don't think sunken aircraft carrier reefs occur naturally.

        Enough defects like leaking shaft seals and they just might occur as a natural result...

        (You'd need significant seal failures, all pumps out, crew not able to make a bucket line (maybe no one thought to put buckets in, modern pumps being so good'n'all), watertight doors/hatches unable to be closed (or not sealing enough), and for some reason no ability to tow her back to port - at 200L/hr it'd take a very long time to even get a noticeable lowering in the waterline!)

    3. John Smith 19 Gold badge
      FAIL

      Billions Above Estimate never disappoint, do they?

      Yes sea trials are to find problems.

      But, y'know, with £3.5 Bn on this tub you'd think they'd managed to get the basics right.

      Especially anything whose repair instructions start "First put ship in dry dock"

      Because the ship is f**king huge.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "With no planes to fly off her, we might as well sink her"?

      Might as well make sure she can float before putting expensive airplanes in it.

  2. Pen-y-gors

    Minor problem

    ...compared with the lack of aircraft, which means they could leave her in permanent dry-dock without impacting her operational capability.

    I'd say more, but after reading the article I feel the need for a wee.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Minor problem

      This is the fault that is "leaked" to the press. We wont hear about the real snags that were found.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        WTF?

        Re: Minor problem

        Isn't it under warranty? If I bought a dingy and it leaked, I would expect the shop I bought it off to fix it for free. Doesn't it work the same way if you spend £3.5 billion?

        1. Matt Hawkins
          Happy

          Re: Minor problem

          It works the same. It will be rectified in accordance with the contract placed on the supplier.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Minor problem

            Probs only came with a 30'000 mile warranty

      2. Matt Hawkins

        Re: Minor problem

        All ships/cars/planes have mechanical issues. "Snags" aren't news. But then The Sun isn't a newspaper so no surprise there!

      3. Tom Paine

        Re: Minor problem

        What, like we didn't hear about the Type 45 shutting down in warm weather?

    2. Voland's right hand Silver badge

      Re: Minor problem

      It can still be used a helicopter carrier. UK still has some left of those.

      It is one hell of an expensive helicopter carrier. The most expensive one in the world in fact.

      This is especially when compared to what that other countries which used to operate Harriers and now are in line for the F32B have bought for a fraction of that money: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_ship_Juan_Carlos_I_(L61)

      In fact, if you look at it, UK could have built ~ 8? ships of the same class for the same amount of money. ~1.5 more "power projection" bang for the same buck even before we take the landing craft launch capability into account. Unfortunately, someone in the Admiralty probably had an issue with the size of his anatomy and needed to order something BIG to prove himself. As a result the really simple idea that "If you build an aircraft carrier that big you might as well order proper planes, not VTOLs for it" did not compute.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Minor problem

        meanwhile HMS Ocean which is a DEDICATED helicopter carrier and supports the marines and can actually come alongside in Devonport (home of the marines) returns home from her final deployment to be paid off. We'll soon have marines with NO marine capability!!!!!

        http://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/hms-ocean-coming-home-christmas-942687

        You really couldn't make this shit up!

    3. IsJustabloke
      Facepalm

      Re: Minor problem

      "compared with the lack of [FIXED WING] aircraft"

      She has choppers aboard so saying she has no aircraft is clearly wrong.

  3. A Non e-mouse Silver badge
    WTF?

    Though defence commentators are, rather predictably, shouting about this being a non-story – and to a point it is an expected defect – it is very much a matter of public concern

    Bollocks. It's a new ship, of new design, and there are some snags and the make will fix them. As the El Reg article says, isn't this the point of things like sea trials? TBH - I'd be very suspicious if there weren't any snags.

    And why did El Reg spend most of the article being all calm, and then throw in that provocative statement. I expected better of El Reg.

    1. Pen-y-gors

      I expected better of El Reg.

      Nah, pure El Reg-ery. You want boring, straight, factual and only slightly-biased reporting, go to the Beeb.

      1. werdsmith Silver badge

        The beeb has gone all sh*t-stirry about it quoting their own "defence correspondent" saying this is "highly embarassing for the Royal Navy".

        I see it as testing the ship to find any faults and fixing them before it goes operational.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          I see it as testing the ship to find any faults and fixing them before it goes operational.

          Indeed. This is the first one of these that they've built - it's not like they had a couple of Queen Liz 2 prototypes under their belts before they got cracking on this particular vessel.

        2. Terry 6 Silver badge

          It seems to be a thing with the Beeb recently. The News web site particularity. Lots of stories about nothing, or headlines focussed on a tiny, attention catching detail of a bigger story. Or massive exaggeration to the point if being fake news. One example of such. There was a headteachers' petition to the govt. recently. A genuine news story, a small deputation took it to no. 10. According to the Beeb headline at the time though headteachers were "marching on Downing St."

          1. Tom Paine

            This story's a good example of the dumbing down on BBC News Online - not that they ran it, in this particular case, but because they picked up a non-starters because the tabloid sewer press both broke and framed the story the previous day. Ten years ago they would be reporting the fact that there was a screamsheet ruckus about it; now, the news agenda is set by the Mail.

            There's been a stair-step down in quality in the last few months due to some management change or other - I forget the details - it was in Private Eye IIRC.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              BBC News Dumbing Down

              I think the BBC News has been dumbing down for quite a few years, especially on the Science and Technology front. My view is that the BBC source their newsreaders from classically educated graduates that generally have poor understanding of mathematics and science. Even in the business sections of the BBC some of the statistics and charts that they post would have failed O level maths/physics exams for being unclear and in many cases, incorrect. There are some exceptions but in general, the BBC is definitely heading down the sensationalist news road. If things don't improve, the BBC will be no better than the Sun and the Daily Mail. So sad.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: BBC News Dumbing Down

                Half the time their grammar is appalling. The other half they are trying to be funny with some witless pun. To be fair the news is a joke now if Trump and Brexit are any guide.

                Even Sky News is doing better than the Beeb.

        3. Tom Paine

          I love the BBC, and those with strong ideological axes to grind (on various sides - more than two) who rave about bias annoy and bore me.

          But I'm embarrassed when I see the 10 o'clock news once a week round my in-laws (long story. Also I have no telly or time.) Radio 4 is the last real, srs, news / current affairs channel left.

          1. PNGuinn
            Big Brother

            Radio 4 is the last real, srs, news / current affairs channel left.

            Radio 4 WAS the last real, srs, news / current affairs channel left, quite a time ago now..

            FIFY.

            Even the archers is a dumbed town bit of pc carp these days (compared to a few years ago).

            Confession: I was working on my own and had radio 4 on. I was not near the set and left it on when TA came on. Father, I have sinned ....

      2. Fred Dibnah

        You really have to be kidding.

    2. This post has been deleted by its author

    3. rh587

      TBH - I'd be very suspicious if there weren't any snags.

      If they don't break something, they're not pushing it hard enough. Something is going to break on trials for the name-ship of a new class. QE is her own prototype.

    4. Steve Evans

      The Beeb are obviously having a slow news day too and have dragged the non-story out all day.

      Including interviewing a retired submarine captain... And even having found a man who should have a mortal terror of a leaky boat, even he was pretty "meh".

      Back of the envelope calculations tell me that at only 200 litres an hour, with no pumps running, and all water-tight doors (of which there are many) left wide open, she'd still be floating into the new year!

      (Assuming she she didn't just fill up on one side and tip over of course).

  4. macjules
    Meh

    "HMS Queen Elizabeth has sprung a leak and everyone's all a-tizzy"

    Well, only The Sun it would appear, according to Reuters.

    Having been a 'from new' Range Rover owner (and never again I might add) I know that the first thing you do is take the vehicle out for a road test and then promptly dropout it back to the showroom with a list of defects that need fixing.

  5. wolfetone Silver badge

    It'd probably sink if an F-35 ever managed to land on it.

    This considers the scenario of such a plane ever being built to fly in the first place.

  6. Prst. V.Jeltz Silver badge

    Big Liz cost the taxpayer £3.5bn to build

    Well , thats less than ONE MONTHs national debt interest payment. If we hadnt let ourselves get 1.7 trillion in debt , we could have a new carrier every month, or maybe some more doctors and nurses.

    1. John Robson Silver badge

      Or we could promise that £3.5b to *all* of the things that cost that much...

      1. Aladdin Sane
        Trollface

        That's 10 weeks of Brexit savings.

        1. Ian Johnston Silver badge

          "That's 10 weeks of Brexit savings."

          Maybe, but that money is all going to the NHS. Boris said so.

          1. wallaby

            "Boris said so."

            if he said so it must be right.....

            right ...??

            1. Adrian 4

              Or 1/20th of brexit exit payment (the government bit, not the industry costs)

            2. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              I will bet £3.5 Billion that Boris won't use the NHS.

    2. Tom Paine

      But we wouldn't be able to afford it, because without money from gilts etc over the last 150 years we'd have the economy of Bulgaria today.

      (That doesn't mean the global capital markets should be treated as a source of endless free money, of course.)

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      > "Well , thats less than ONE MONTHs national debt interest payment."

      LoL National finances aren't like your house finances.

      1. Prst. V.Jeltz Silver badge

        "LoL National finances aren't like your house finances.

        I would imagine there are similarities , like borrowing to avoid a small bit of pain eventually accumulates into a major headcache that would have been easier to deal with a bite at a time as it came up.

        That wouldnt keep you elected though I guess.

  7. Hans Neeson-Bumpsadese Silver badge

    God bless her...

    ...and all who bail in her.

    1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
      Happy

      Re: God bless her...

      One person could bail this leak with a teaspoon.

      Actually make that a cup. It's 0.06 L/sec, so you'd have to move your arms really fast with a teaspoon...

      1. This post has been deleted by its author

      2. Mike Moyle

        Re: God bless her...

        It's not so much the size of the leak; it's carrying the [teaspoon|bucket] up seven or eight decks from the bilge to dump overboard that takes the bulk of the time!

        1. Stoneshop
          Pirate

          Re: God bless her...

          It's not so much the size of the leak; it's carrying the [teaspoon|bucket] up seven or eight decks from the bilge to dump overboard that takes the bulk of the time!

          You then order some junior deckhand to take that bucket topside and dump its contents overboard, while leaving another, empty, bucket down in the bilge for the Master Leakscooper to fill. If one can't keep up that way you line up a bucket brigade.

          1. Tom Paine

            Re: God bless her...

            If one can't keep up that way you line up a bucket brigade.

            Imagine how much money an Able Seaman Third Class could make if he smuggled a camera in and sold that pic to the tabloids!

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