"In boat heaven"
Did it keel over?
(sorry, that was a hull of a bad joke)
Landlubber northern council shores up against boat-tipping
One landlocked council's battle with fly-tipping has taken a nautical twist this week after it had to deal with a speedboat... left in a road. The boat was found in the northern English town of Doncaster, which is just north of Sheffield in England – and about 50 miles from the sea. Doncaster Council decided to chart the …
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 13:36 GMT Daedalus
One of these days...
Councils in the UK will eventually figure out that making it difficult and/or expensive to get rid of unwanted stuff is what drives fly-tipping. Most towns in the US turn a blind eye to objects left out for collection, and by and large those objects either get picked up by the garbage collectors or by "informal" collectors aka scavengers. Leaving something out at the kerb in the UK will apparently get you a visit from all kinds of bureaucracy-driven thugs ready to rip you a new one.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 14:15 GMT frank ly
Re: One of these days...
My local dump used to accept 'domestic' (transported in your car) loads of soil and rubble. Now they charge £2.50 a bag (and tell you the size of a standard bag).
I wish I'd completed my garden landscaping and raised bed making activities last year instead of getting lazy.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 14:43 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: One of these days...
> My local dump used to accept 'domestic' (transported in your car) loads of soil and rubble.
> Now they charge £2.50 a bag (and tell you the size of a standard bag).
Mine did that, and now they're embroiled in a court case to work out if it's legal (by law, they're required to accept at no charge any waste a householder may reasonably create in the running of their household*).
* my paraphrasing of the situation
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 16:38 GMT Doctor Syntax
Re: One of these days...
"Mine did that, and now they're embroiled in a court case to work out if it's legal"
Do you have a link to any reports of this. I'm sure a lot of us would be interested in the outcome.
My local council instituted similar shenanigans a little while ago which included registering vehicles, limits on the size of vehicle that could visit the sites, the size of trailers and removing the rubble and plasterboard skips. Everybody told them it would increase fly tipping and end up costing them more but they went ahead. Oddly enough, fly tipping has increased.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 17:18 GMT Robert Carnegie
Re: One of these days...
It probably costs you more than £2.50 to drive to the council dumping facility. You're making a big objection to a small charge on what presumably ends up being expensive and unecological landfill somewhere.
Come Brexit we shall need to produce more food inland anyway, so, stuff your landscaping, and Dig For Victory and potatoes.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 17:46 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: One of these days...
Come Brexit we shall need to produce more food inland anyway
Why? We can just buy it from developing nations currently shat upon by the EU's "circled wagons" approach to free trade that puts significant duties on those agricultural imports to benefit (mainly) French farmers.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 18:21 GMT nsld
Re: One of these days...
"Come Brexit we shall need to produce more food inland anyway
Why? We can just buy it from developing nations currently shat upon by the EU's "circled wagons" approach to free trade that puts significant duties on those agricultural imports to benefit (mainly) French farmers."
We already do and much of it is duty or tariff free under the 'anything but arms' scheme.
As for trading bloc protection its always made me laugh that so many brexit advocates in politics are in the pay of US sugar producer Tate & Lyle and seem to think the destruction of British Sugar and UK Beet farmers is a good thing to benefit a US company and Caribean farmers!
Then we get onto how you transport your veg from far away lands to ensure its still edible and the cost of the food miles involved.
The Minford fantasy of free trade and zero import tariffs for all will destroy UK manufacturing and farming and leave us dependent on foreign powers for our food and other criticial supplies. Not good from a jobs perspective, or food security or anything really.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 14:21 GMT Jason Bloomberg
Re: One of these days...
I don't know if it's as bad as you paint it in the UK but I would have to admit that I'm not sure what the actual situation is if someone leaves something out with the hope of it being taken. We certainly do have a good number of officious a-holes and do-gooders around. It's not as simple as put it out and hope it disappear.
On the kerb it's probably some kind of obstruction, and taking something on the presumption it was intended to be taken is a potentially risky venture. I dread to think what happens if someone leaves something out labelled 'take this' and then some injury or harm comes to anyone who does, who would be responsible. I thought about putting DVDs I no longer want outside for others to pick up but feared the backlash if anyone took something rated above their age.
Lack of clarity and knowledge of the law is the real problem. I think fear and risk of it not going well means we just don't do that. Taking or giving. Even skip-diving is a dodgy proposition
I suppose one solution is to put things out with a 'please ask to take' note. Once they've asked it's a proper transaction; 'sold (for free) as seen'.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 16:51 GMT Gene Cash
Re: One of these days...
On the kerb it's probably some kind of obstruction, and taking something on the presumption it was intended to be taken is a potentially risky venture
Hm. Here in the US (Orlando) I leave things "on the kerb" every Thursday night for the waste people to pick up on Friday. I pay local taxes to have them come around every week.
The major stipulation is that you kindly break it down into chunks of 50lb or less. Heck, they even took chunks of fence and other hurricane debris recently.
If you have something as large as a boat, there's a number to call to arrange pickup. They even accept cars.
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Friday 3rd November 2017 12:34 GMT CrazyOldCatMan
Re: One of these days...
It's not as simple as put it out and hope it disappear.
Legally, *you* are responsible for disposing of stuff properly. So no - leaving it out on the kerb is not viable.
I suppose one solution is to put things out with a 'please ask to take' note. Once they've asked it's a proper transaction; 'sold (for free) as seen'.
If it's on your property, possibly (subject to WEEE regulations and hazardous waste/HSE regs - so not putting out old electronics or stuff with lithium batteries in). If you dump it on public property (ie the road or kerb) then no since that's a breach of the regulations.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 20:39 GMT Steve Davies 3
Re: One of these days...
Yep.
Down here in Hampshire, they are proposing charging ratepayers to use the recycling centres.
They seem oblivious to the fact that
1) we have already paid for the service in our Council Tax
2) if they do this then the council will have to spend far more than they receive in clearing up the inevitable increase in fly-tipped rubbish.
It does not take a genius to realise what their actions will cause.
Never mind, I'm sure the £200,000K per year chief executive will be getting his 10% bonus as usual.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 20:54 GMT PNGuinn
Re: One of these days...@ Daedalus
Er ... no.
My local authority will arrange a FREE collection for bulky refuse. Does it stop the tippers? Not generally.
The enforcement team, prosecutions and large fines may convince more of 'em that it just aint worth the risk.
And by the way, most of the fly tipped rubbish obviously arrives by car. Just too much trouble to take it the tip for free, y'know.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 22:10 GMT AdamWill
Re: One of these days...
In other words: you're a lazy fucker who wants other people to pay so you don't have to deal with your own waste.
You should plan for how you're going to get rid of something before you buy it. Once you buy it, it's your responsibility. I've no idea why you think it should be fine for you to just leave it outside for "the garbage collectors" to collect; what do you think garbage collectors are, magic pixies who appear from another dimension to take your shit away? They're government employees, which means *we're all fucking paying for them*. When you're done with your stuff, take it to the appropriate place for disposal / recycling. If you're not willing to do that, don't fucking buy anything you can't put in your domestic waste when you're done with it. Jesus.
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Friday 3rd November 2017 10:31 GMT Doctor Syntax
Re: One of these days...
"In other words: you're a lazy fucker who wants other people to pay so you don't have to deal with your own waste."
Because you're too lazy to quote properly it's impossible to be clear to whom you're replying but let's be clear about this:
We pay council taxes for local councils to provide services. One of the services is collection and disposal of waste. (Others include running local libraries and other such facilities.) Increasingly local councils are abnegating the provision of such services.
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Saturday 4th November 2017 00:54 GMT AdamWill
Re: One of these days...
"Because you're too lazy to quote properly it's impossible to be clear to whom you're replying but let's be clear about this:"
Well, nah, it's because the Reg's comment system stinks. I replied to a specific comment. Any comment system worth its salt ought to be able to indicate that in its presentation. If it can't, that ain't my problem.
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Monday 6th November 2017 10:33 GMT Baldrickk
Re: One of these days...
Well, nah, it's because the Reg's comment system stinks. I replied to a specific comment. Any comment system worth its salt ought to be able to indicate that in its presentation. If it can't, that ain't my problem.
As a silver badged commenter, you obviously have experience with the system and know its faults. Typing "blockquote" twice with a copy and paste is too hard is it?
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Saturday 4th November 2017 01:02 GMT AdamWill
Re: One of these days...
"We pay council taxes for local councils to provide services. One of the services is collection and disposal of waste. (Others include running local libraries and other such facilities.) Increasingly local councils are abnegating the provision of such services."
Well, nah, I disagree. Councils haven't, historically, offered 'collection' of non-household waste at all. Collection of household waste makes economic sense, because every household makes it all the time; it's much more efficient (economically, environmentally, etc etc) for the council to send trucks round to collect the waste from hundreds of houses at once than for everyone to drive 30 litres of waste over to the tip or whatever. But the case for 'collection' of large items - the stuff that *can't* easily and efficiently be collected by garbage trucks from standard-sized bins - is much less obvious. It's not like every household chucks out a couch every Tuesday, regular.
But okay, I should clarify. What annoys me is the mindset that says "well I'm done with this couch and I can't be arsed getting rid of it properly, so I'm just going to ditch it on the sidewalk and expect some other fucker to get rid of it for me" *even when* your local council or whatever doesn't actually do that. If the council of some area or other decides it wants to offer this kind of curbside pickup and that decision is endorsed by the voters (or whatever), great, fine, that's their business. But if that's *not* actually a service your council offers, then it's your damn responsibility to deal with your own garbage.
It's worth noting that councils in the UK have had their central government funding *drastically* cut ever since the 'austerity' era started, which is the obvious reason why they're cutting back on waste services. It's not exactly surprising that if you stop funding councils properly, they won't provide proper services. But of course, everyone always wants five star service at one star cost; you try getting into politics and selling people on tax rises to pay for better waste services.
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Friday 3rd November 2017 12:29 GMT CrazyOldCatMan
Re: One of these days...
Councils in the UK will eventually figure out that making it difficult and/or expensive to get rid of unwanted stuff
Most of the fly-tipping (here in Wiltshire anyway) is done by scam artists who set up companies to sell waste management to small businesses and households. And, in a move that will surprise no-one, the scam artists get paid but, instead of actually disposing of stuff properly, just drop it in some poor farmers field access road and scarper.
They make dosh for a couple of months then fold that company and register another. And getting hit by council waste disposal actions is just another cost of business for them and something that inevitably costs less than the profit they have made.
The thing is, it *is* up to you to ensure that the waste you produce is disposed of properly. So paying some fly-by-night group of scammers to do it can also lend you in trouble too.
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Thursday 2nd November 2017 21:04 GMT PNGuinn
Doncaster?
"Possibly, but Hull is even less north of Sheffield than Donny is. I wonder if the El Reg offices are still using Apple Maps?"
Mmmm ...... 'Twas thinking that. North of Sheffield. Barnsley?
Maybe the author's compass was playing up ... Still, Doncaster's still a sizable overland journey ....Oops.
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