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Microsoft fixing Windows 10 'stuttering' bugs in Creators Update

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Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

I can speak on behalf of my girlfriend when I say "Lucky gamers - they actually got something fixed." Seeing her endless frustrations with Windows 10 reminds of the worst days of Windows 3.1 when you needed a witch doctor, a chicken to wave, and a CDROM full of possible driver candidates to make the thing work.

She's smart and experienced, and so am I, but we've largely given up trying to understand the downright strange and inexplicable things that Windows 10 does.

But hey, at least they're working hard to get VR perfected!

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

What you're witnessing now is SatNad skimping on software testing and adopting the philosophy of 'ship it and we'll fix it along the way'.

Also, crowdsourcing QA to a bunch of fanboys ('Insiders') isn't really a wise decision.

Back in the day, if a Service Pack for Windows came out, you could put off upgrading immediately and let the early adopters dip their toes in the water first so see if there were any problems.

Now, everyone is an early adopter no thanks to the always-on and mandatory Windows updates pushed to you. Oh, and did I mention the inferior QA?

SatNad should get the basics of a software company right instead of incessantly chasing the cloud and the next fad.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

Ok troll, here's your daily bread:

Since Vista, we've been able to disable auto-updates through the services panel. Open services.msc, scroll to the bottom, stop Windows Update, then disable it. Voila, no more updates until you re-enable Windows Update.

It's not like MS never tried to force insufficiently tested updates on people with Win7 or something.

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"Also, crowdsourcing QA to a bunch of fanboys ('Insiders') isn't really a wise decision." - Slurp's epitaph on their corporate tombstone. QA needs to be done by people who know what they are doing and have well thought out testing plans. Letting random users 'find' and 'report' issues is a recipe for disaster. Slurp is relying on users actually using something to find an error instead deliberately trying it out in a controlled manner. Reporting issues from users is always problematic as many may not file a bug report especially if the process is too convoluted.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

I usually don't defend Microsoft too much, but I still remember the saga of the Linux schedulers around 2.6.x... iterative improvements and new ideas on what the actual problems were relied a lot on user reports from a bunch of enthusiasts taking the latest kernels in use ("fanboys", if you prefer).

And this stuttering problem does seems to be the kind of issue where you can have the most professional QA in the world, and never hit some of the corner cases that the some users will consistently encounter.

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"It's not like MS never tried to force insufficiently tested updates on people with Win7 or something."

Actually they didn't. Until that "special" update called Windows 10...

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LDS
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Devil

"SatNad should get the basics of a software company"

He did, but of a Mumbai-based one...

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

Didn't Microsoft promise some low latency gaming pipeline bullcrap for this update?? They delivered the exact opposite... As usual for Microsoft.... Not that it matters, PC in the home is dead, PC gaming is dead...

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

>Actually they didn't.

Actually they did, rememeber that update? the one which WuP installed after SP1 but had to be installed prior to SP1 so that SP1 could install...

Since XP-SP2/2K3 (and Office 2K3) its largely been downhill all the way, unfortunately since 8 things do seem to be gaining momentum...

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"but we've largely given up trying to understand the downright strange and inexplicable things that Windows 10 does."

My sister phoned me the other day because Windows 10 Mail kept on reporting that her @BTInternet.com email settings were out of date and needed to be amended. However Windows Mail provided no settings to change the server information. When you went to manage accounts there was simply the option to change the mail box name or to delete the account. Because Windows 10 'recognised' the email address it tries to configure everything automatically and doesn't allow you to customise your entry. The only way I managed to get things working in the end was for my sister to create an account with a fake email address and then select manual settings during set-up and correct the email address afterwards. I've been working with Windows for around twenty years now (I was really bad in a previous life) and I have to agree Windows 10 is the strangest version yet.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"What you're witnessing now is SatNad skimping on software testing and adopting the philosophy of 'ship it and we'll fix it along the way'."

No, it's being fixed by the GA ship date as per the article.

"Also, crowdsourcing QA to a bunch of fanboys ('Insiders') isn't really a wise decision."

What better QA testers would you suggest than actual real world users?!

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"Ok troll, here's your daily bread:

Since Vista, we've been able to disable auto-updates through the services panel."

Ok, fanboi, here's yours. Since Windows 10, you have only been able to defer upgrades for a few months and then only if you have paid for some corporate licence.

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"What better QA testers would you suggest than actual real world users?!"

1) Someone with a contact on the development team to whom they could report bugs.

2) Someone who has documentation for how the software is supposed to behave.

3a) Someone who is actually paid to do it full-time.

3b) Someone who isn't trying to do some other full-time job in order to pay their bills.

4) Someone who has been trained to anticipate likely errors in implementation.

But of course, that would cost money whereas just shipping shit apparently doesn't, so ...

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"Actually they didn't. Until that "special" update called Windows 10..."

On "consumer" versions of the OS you can defer updates via the GUI or disable them via disabling the update service. On corporate versions you can turn updates off via the GUI. Microsoft have taken the imo sensible decision that you shouldn't be able to disable updates unless you know what you are doing...

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"When you went to manage accounts there was simply the option to change the mail box name or to delete the account. "

See https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/6135-add-delete-account-windows-10-mail-app.html

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

Looks a useful site. Unfortunately with the BTInternet account, (because set-up couldn't complete due to outdated information?) the option to modify settings wasn't shown. I know it should have been shown but it just wasn't there. Complete PITA. Have an upvote for the helpful advice anyway. :-)

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"What better QA testers would you suggest than actual real world users?!"

People who know how to stress test, narrow the scope of a bug, and write an actionable bug report. People who actually run the stuff natively and not just in a VM. People who know how to test-- it's more than just using it and seeing what happens.

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

"Looks a useful site. Unfortunately with the BTInternet account, (because set-up couldn't complete due to outdated information?) the option to modify settings wasn't shown."

It should be. Open the Windows Store app and check for updates - so that you ensure the Mail app is the current version. The RTM version was very buggy.

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Re: Sigh, Poor Ordinary Folks

>Unfortunately with the BTInternet account, ... the option to modify settings wasn't shown.

I've just been through Windows Mail problems with a friend...

To resolve them, I've effectively disabled Windows mail and installed eM Client.

Whilst there are better clients, this one seems to do the job if all you need is basic email as Microsoft originally shipped with Windows, that integrates with Live/Outlook.Com and other web mail services plus it works around the Photo Email problem Windows Live Mail 2012 and Windows 10 Mail suffer from - so users can right click on a picture file and send to > email recipient.

Mind you as my 'canary' Win10 tablet finally got the Creators Update yesterday evening, I'll be taking a look at the new Windows Mail app.

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Anonymous Coward

I rebuilt an old 486 DOS box

Having a great time playing old DOS games!

Old tech without the issues.

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Thumb Up

Re: I rebuilt an old 486 DOS box

That would make an interesting article if you wouldn't mind putting the effort into it.

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FAIL

Nope

A friend's Win 10 box can't even stream iPlayer without the video stuttering and crackles on the audio. I came, I saw, I left her to it!

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Re: Nope

Our Win 10 machine sometimes refuses to go fullscreen, leaving the Iplayer controls stuck at the bottom.

No apparent reason. We've ruled out phases of the moon, but the Sun was moving into Leo, so suspect something was influenced by my horoscope.

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Re: Nope

"A friend's Win 10 box can't even stream iPlayer without the video stuttering and crackles on the audio"

Assuming that is something from Apple, part of iTunes, that would most likely be an Apple issue.

iTunes is a POS on Windows compared to OSX. It's hard to know if it's Apple trying to punish Windows users and shift them to OSX, or MS trying to punish Apple, or just Apple hiring sh*t programmers for the Windows version (which, would be trying to punish WIndows users, as they certainly could afford making a proper effort).

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Re: Nope

At first I was wondering how the fuck you assumed it was Apple. Oh, the i.

BBC iPlayer. Also - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linksys_iPhone

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Re: Nope

"Assuming that is something from Apple"

Nope, but I can see how a non-Brit might jump to that assumption.

The second part of your comment is correct though, iTunes on Windows sucks mightily.

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Re: Nope

"iTunes is a POS on Windows compared to OSX."

Sorry have to disagree. ITunes is a POS on my Macbook Pro as well.

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Re: Nope

>A friend's Win 10 box can't even stream iPlayer without the video stuttering and crackles on the audio. I came, I saw, I left her to it!

Recently I did similiar, however: I came, I saw, I demonstrated (faultless) iPlayer/ITVHub playback of the same source material on an iPad over their wifi, then I left them to it...

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Re: Nope

Sure, but it's a BIGGER POS on Windows. Much bigger.

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Re: Nope

Oh, that iPlayer.. BBC.. Forgot about it. I live in the UK..

Well, what do you expect from BBC? They only have billions to spend..

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Re: Nope

Out of interest, have people getting stuttering problems tried a different web browser (and disabling Flash)?

I used to have lots of problems with iPlayer in Firefox, but it worked fine in Chrome.

(Now it works fine in both under Win10, but my computer is hardly low end, so it's probably not a good example)

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Re: Nope

>Out of interest, have people getting stuttering problems tried a different web browser (and disabling Flash)?

Just download iPlayer Download (uninstall any previous version of iPlayer and Adobe AIR), their standalone player, and use that. Okay there are some things, like live sport, which they insist on serving directly from their website and hence require a browser.

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cb7

Fast startup? No thank you

The Fast Startup 'feature' that's been a part of Windows since Win8, is buggy.

I've lost count of the number of machines that get bogged down with some system processes stuck in a loop sucking up all cpu resources bringing the machine to its knees.

Yes you can restart the machine to lift the misery, but it's only temporary relief. Some time later, the problem will return.

Turn off Fast Startup and this doesn't happen. Until the next forced update from MS turns it back on again.

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Re: Fast startup? No thank you

Fast Startup is actually a sort of semi-hibernate, so most of its weirdness happens at shutdown. Except that there are probably many drivers that don't properly handle it. And probably some of those faulty drivers come from the company formerly known as Bill's Boys, then Monkey Boy's Crew.

And thanks for reminding me to check to see if it is still off...

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Re: Fast startup? No thank you

"Turn off Fast Startup and this doesn't happen. Until the next forced update from MS turns it back on again."

I had a machine that borked the 1607->1703 upgrade, several times, until I switched off Fast Startup.

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A Gamer's Story

Once upon a time, there was a gamer. He was bored but he had a few hours to spare before bed, so he turned on his pc. After startup he clicked on his favor online video game icon in hoping to enjoy some quality online game time.

But then a blue screen popped up with the word 'updating' came in before he could do anything.

The pc got the Newest Creators Update installed. He clicked on the game icon once again, but he couldn't play anymore with the game stuttering and dropping frame rates like a snail.

So he could never enjoy his time with his game again... Until he swapped the HD with his old Windows 7, where he played happily ever after.

(and Microsoft still wonders why some gamers stayed with Windows 7.)

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Re: A Gamer's Story

This reminds me how I just a few days ago had to quickly help my son with his PC, and realising I had to install something from my account I switched to sign in as myself. Guess what..

"Hi!"... "Installing updates, this may take a while".. "I'm the effing annoying text prompter that pretends I'm some effing AI robot from the future talking to you while doing some I'll implemented updates that takes forever".."Enjoy!"

Would it be too much to ask to not have updates installed upon switching user?

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Reasons to be cheerful

That Microsoft have fubar'ed the pushing of Creators Update and I've not received it.

(I'm beginning to suspect it's because I'm running the Education variant, from the Imagine site...Business and Education users need not apply...)

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Re: Reasons to be cheerful

Are you a MS Insider, and asked for the update specifically?

If not, then as mentioned in the article, it's not out yet.

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Facepalm! Windows 10 1607 Aniversary Update "Defer Updates" setting is back to front.

EddieD, you must have missed my comment regarding Creators Update the other day, but here is the reason you haven't received Creators Update. (and how to fix it).

Microsoft really do have 'egg on their face' regarding this.

Previous Comment (from 8/09/2017)

------------------------------------------------

Here's another major flaw too.

Could it be someone at Microsoft got their wording/digital states: 1 and 0 (true and false) mixed up? Seems so.

For those people running Windows 10 1607 AU wondering why they haven't been offered Windows 10 1703 Creators Update, it turns out:

Windows Settings->Update and security->Advanced Options->Defer Feature updates

This toggle switch appears to be operating back to front. (This might sound odd that no one has noticed this before, but it does appear to be the case)

(Check first that on your system the toggle is off (i.e. no tick in the box), the system is set "not to defer updates")

Select 'Defer Feature updates' (i.e place a tick in the box) then go back and check for updates, it then finds the update. (The switch operation seems to be the wrong way round).

If you break the 1703 update process (to test) i.e. don't complete the update at this point (you'll get a failed update in your update history though), then toggle the switch off again (i.e. remove the tick in the box to 'Defer Feature updates'), when you check for updates again the 1703 update option disappears.

Which seems to prove the switch is working opposite way to the way it should. Well done Microsoft.

(Seems crazy to think a Company the size of Microsoft could make such a simple fundamental mistake, which has such massive consequences to the roll out of new versions of the Windows 10 OS, but these things happen).

If this is the reason, there are so many not getting this update, that is highly embarrassing for MS, an 'egg on face' moment, especially given they've been quite coy regards the latest figures for number of active installs of Windows 10.

MS are not going to get many 1703 upgrades in the interim before 1709, if they have all been 'deferred'. But maybe MS saw it as a way of dealing with complaints of 'upgrade overload', to give users/consumers a break.

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Re: Facepalm! Windows 10 1607 Aniversary Update "Defer Updates" setting is back to front.

No, I didn't miss it, and offered you a beer.

The problem is, in the 1607 update, the defer update has been removed from the Update section of settings in Enterprise (and by extension, Education) versions of Win 10, and can only be accessed via GPEDIT, and using that has had no effect.

And, I am on the insiders program at work, but this is about the first Creators Update being applied to my home machine, not the second.

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Re: Reasons to be cheerful

For some reason it's been pushing me for the last month to install the damn thing. I'm definitely not a MS Insider, and I don't want the damn thing at all!

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What car?

Would a struggling McLaren Honda be more appropriate?

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Anonymous Coward

RE: What car?

...for a moment I thought it was Verstappen, that would explain a lot of his DNF's, but this looks like Ricciardo so your suggestion is indeed more appropriate.

I recently bought a laptop with windows 10, one of the odd things is sometimes the active window will go black for no apperent reason, only resizing it will bring back the content. I haven't seen cr*p like that since windows 3.1 I think so bringing back the "Workstation" name seems the right thing to do...

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i spotted it along time ago and fixed it along time ago, its just the network settings

if you want them you have to hit a troll site http://www.esreality.com/post/2890743/some-better-lightspeed-network-settings-to-try/

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Stuttering and slurping

I assume that the stuttering is caused by the slurping calling home. I bet if all the slurping was switched off there would smooth play in the games.

I expect that MS will 'fix' this problem by storing what they slurp until a non games program is run - oh joy not.

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Re: Stuttering and slurping

"I assume that the stuttering is caused by the slurping calling home. I bet if all the slurping was switched off there would smooth play in the games."

I think you give too much credit to MS.

They tend to break things regularly just because they can't be bothered thinking through the consequences of a change, and the MS people know they are 100% insulated from any angry users. Example: Breaking masses of web-cams overnight just because they don't give a sh*t. No valid technical reason. Won't lift a finger, unless it's money in on the spreadsheet.

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FFS

Microsoft fixing bugs? Hmm

They haven't fixed the bug in using different icons for the recycle bin.

They haven't fixed networking so that all the computers on a simple SOHO little network appear in network places, on every machine, every time.Both been an issue since XP days. And these should be pretty simple things to do.

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Re: FFS

Re: Microsoft fixing bugs?

Does anyone know if they have fixed the Photo Email problem MS introduced back in June 2015 when it changed the way SkyDrive/OneDrive worked and left the Windows Photo Email function broken in Windows 7/8/10?

[Aside: It seems the default action to send photo's as links to Albums held on OneDrive has been hard-coded into Windows/Windows Mail. So whilst there is a workaround there appears to be no way to change the default action.]

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Anonymous Coward

You do realise that all that telemetry takes CPU cycles.

POS

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