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Whoosh, there it is: Toshiba bods say 14TB helium-filled disk is coming soon

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Fuck a duck!

My first HDD was 20MB in my old Archimedes, and I know plenty of people who had smaller drives before me.

Remember having to clear out 650MB to make an ISO before writing a CD? Kids today etc etc...

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Re: Fuck a duck!

Indeed do remember - 20MB hard drive in a PC-AT supporting a group of 30 people (started work in 1990 at a Big 6 accountancy firm).

The Internet was only available in black and white then - and they switched it off at the weekends (your recollections may vary............).

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Windows

Re: Fuck a duck!

I'll take your B & W Internet and raise you an acoustic coupler.

Need a new 'grey haired old git' icon.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

"...raise you an acoustic coupler."

I'll match that and raise the bid with a teleprinter.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Fuck a duck!

I still have a 40mb hard drive in my special parts box along with a 286 and some memory that Bill Gates would approve of. I'll donate it to a museum one day.

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Thumb Up

Re: Fuck a duck!

After seeing the 400GB storage on a MicroSD card the size of a fingernail yesterday, we were reminiscing about the old 20mb MFM drive days that were the size of a brick.

So give it a few years and that 12TB will be on a MicroSD card and even smaller eventually.

Different technologies with different pro's and cons but it's still good fun to compare size and storage :)

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Re: Fuck a duck!

An ASR-33 to be precise?

In them days we backed up our source code to paper tape.... :)

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pah

Real people got a KSR-33, innit.

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Coat

Re: Fuck a duck!

Which one? 110 Baud or a more 'modern' 300 Baud Cat? ;-)

As to the Internet being only B&W hog wash... a couple of friends and I went in to the EE Dept's vision lab and used the camera to make a copy of a playboy centerfold, in gasp *COLOR* and put it up on usenet. That was in the late 80's.

Mine's the coat with a pocket protector because my lead holders had sharp metal tips.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

@Ian

Colour centrefold on the Internet? Wouldn't be Lena Soderberg by any chance? I still remember her being used as one of the JPEG test subjects...

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Re: Fuck a duck!

I remember having a 5Mb removable platter at Uni. Then in my first job, there were these 80Mb removable which were like 5 platters and quite an effort to lift and transport the platters.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

Some of us started on Amstrad 8256 computers, with no hard drive. You had to load the OS and then the apps by shuffling the non-standard floppy disks around, a process that took several minutes, then used a 'data' disk to work off of.

Kids today.

Then I got a Mac Plus with no HD and '2' floppy disk drives......

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Fuck a duck!

You were spoilt. Some of us started with punched cards and paper tapes before graduating (literaly) to 256kbyte single sided single density 8 inch floppy disk drives.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

I'll match the B&W internet, acoustic coupler and teleprinter and raise you a Dynabyte model 5100 complete with the S-100 bus, 8 inch floppies and linear power supplies!

http://www.oldcomputers.net/dynabyte.html

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Re: Fuck a duck!

Commodore 5 Megabyte external IEEE-488 connected hard drive around the size of a toaster hooked to my Commodore B-128.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

Exactly, rack mounted teletype terminal hooked to my micro a bit higher in the rack. Video terminal came later. Ahh, 110 baud.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

luxury!

ICL 1904, punch paper tape and teletype console. Coding sheets.

1977-1979 Allt-yr-yn college, Newport in the 6th form.

ICL ME29 was my first computer I was responsible for. 8" floppy disc. 1984. online TP and EDS80 disc platter (that's 60MB useable) for backup.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

I remember booting up our old PDP-12. Octal keys. Flip, flip, flip, load/execute. Flip, flip, flip, load/execute. Flip, flip, flip, load/execute. Flip, flip, fl... damn! Reset... flip, flip, flip...

BIOS spoiled everyone.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

eds80's

http://www.computerconservationsociety.org/resurrection/images/images74/resn.jpg

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Re: Fuck a duck!

http://www.computerconservationsociety.org/resurrection/images/images74/resn.jpg

these

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Re: Fuck a duck!

Luxury!

10Mb in our DMS HiNet Z80 based file server - and 8" single sided 160K floppy disks as well.

You tell the youngsters of today and they won't believe you.

Internet - the network was a 9 pin ribbon serial cable.

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Re: Fuck a duck!

Five megabytes! You were spoilt.

I started on an 3kb Acorn atom with a bit-banging tape drive... Definitely B+W to start with. I think it ended up having 4 colours..

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Devil

Fourteen terabytes? That's a lot of porn!

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Trollface

But not all of it - not by a long shot !

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Anonymous Coward

Depends if it's dwarf porn, that takes up less space.

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Helium?

I'm impressed that they go so far to reduce the weight of the product by filling it with helium, although wouldn't vacuum be even better?

I remember chatting to a bloke who used a helium-filled barrage balloon for advertising at events. Rather than faffing around with cylinders of expensive gas he just had a large trailer and pumped the gas from the balloon to a bag in the trailer and vice versa. Probably the only time when a laden trailer weighed less than an un-laden!

[Yes,I know, probably really something boring to do with air resistance and the read heads]

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Joke

Re: Helium?

One feature is that when the bearing go, the sequel is so high pitched in the helium drives (around 38kHz) that user don't notice and continue using the drive instead of returning it for warranty replacement.

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Re: Helium?

I hope you're joking.

Hard drives cannot run in vacuum because their operation relies on the Bernoulli Effect: a cushioning phenomenon that occurs with gases even at tiny gaps (like the infinitesimal gaps between hard drive platters and hard drive heads). Thing is, the Bernoulli Effect relies on there being a gas to work. Vacuum is the lack of gas, see?

The idea here is that helium, in contrast to say nitrogen, is a lot better gas to work with aerodynamically (it's not only atomic number 2, but as a noble gas, it exists atomically in contrast to nitrogen which normally exists as a gas in diatomic molecules--paired up--doubling its molecular weight). Catch is, helium is SO small you need special handling to keep it from getting away (as it's small enough to pass through gaps in otherwise-solid materials).

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Re: Helium?

Catch is, helium is SO small you need special handling to keep it from getting away

I wonder how long mass produced HDDs will keep the helium in for? And what will be the consequence of it leaking out?

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Re: Helium?

"Catch is, helium is SO small you need special handling to keep it from getting away (as it's small enough to pass through gaps in otherwise-solid materials)."

Is the helium pressurised inside the HDD?

If not, and if the HDD enclosure material is porous enough to just let helium atoms pass then something must replace the helium because "nature abhors vacuum". Since a hydrogen atom is smaller than a helium atom, only hydrogen can replace the missing volume. Excluding the flammable nature of hydrogen, would it pose a problem for the drive?

I'm just a layman with only high school physics classes decades ago so bear with my likely flawed reasoning here!

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Re: Helium?

The catch is that hydrogen normally exists as a gas in diatomic form (H2), whereas helium is a noble gas and can exist monatomically.

Anyway, part of the delay in rolling out helium drives has been time spent developing and mass-producing a VERY gas-tight enclosure for them.

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Re: Helium?

"I wonder how long mass produced HDDs will keep the helium in for?"

"At least the warranty period"

"And what will be the consequence of it leaking out?"

Increasing power consumption, slower access and eventually read failures due to the fly height of the heads being too high for reliable data.

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How long is that drive going to take to format ?

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format? try fsck

or chkdisk I suppose.

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I would be more concerned with RAID rebuilds on a set of drives that size, because people are totally going to stick them in QNAPs and the whatnot - very popular in the SMB space.

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RE: RAID re-builds

I was thinking the same thing.

IIRC, while the density of these drives are packing in more bits per square mm, the BER (bit error rate) isn't lowered, and with more bits per platter you have a higher potential for drive failure, and RAID re-build.

I am not so sure that I would want to chance re-building a 14TB RAID array.

Some one else can be a guinea pig.

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Re: RE: RAID re-builds

"I am not so sure that I would want to chance re-building a 14TB RAID array."

I have a 32TB one at home and multiple 300TB ones at work. Raidz3 means that they're statistically very unlikely to suffer drive failure during rebuilds (and I test that regularly as part of my operating paranoia)

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Need to check if it's any use for A/V storage

> helium-filled disk is coming soon

Does it make all the voices on audio tracks sound squeaky?

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Re: Need to check if it's any use for A/V storage

Only if you're writing for a hifi magazine. Best use one of those directional network cables...

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Re: Need to check if it's any use for A/V storage

And make sure it's grey. Color-coded ribbon cables make the data sound different. Blindfolded volunteers in a lab test confirmed that.

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Trollface

Re: Need to check if it's any use for A/V storage

"Best use one of those directional network cables..."

For the ultimate in audio purity, a pair of garden hoses full of mercury is the ultimate best speaker wire. It's even better than long crystal copper and allows you to hear every nuance of the performance including that mosquito farting beside the timpanis during the intermezzo.

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Anonymous Coward

Wow

Thats a hell of a Porn Stash!

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Childcatcher

@AC ...Re: Wow

Now when you consider that you're future proofing it.

All of the stuff is going to be hi-res.

Today 4K tomorrow (a couple of years) 8K .

The only problem is that you can now make out the ass acne and makeup can't hide all of the blemishes.

But at 8K, how much storage is required for a full length flick?

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Re: @AC ...Wow

The only problem is that you can now make out the ass acne and makeup can't hide all of the blemishes.

No doubt there will be a custom GPU to deal with stuff like that, already today the Asians have "beautifying" algorithms built into their cameras and smartphones.

What will really eat storage is bio-printing combined with porn ...

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Helium is tricksy stuff if I recall correctly.

So, How Long does it take for the helium to bleed out?

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Re: Helium is tricksy stuff if I recall correctly.

So, How Long does it take for the helium to bleed out?

Slightly longer than the warranty lasts

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Helium is tricksy stuff if I recall correctly.

@ MonkeyBob: VERY Slightly longer than the warranty lasts, remembering we can measure time with quartz accuracy

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Helium is tricksy stuff if I recall correctly.

One reason why my next hard drive purchase will definitely NOT (knowingly) be a Helium filled drive. Or a shingled magnetic drive (SMR) that has to rewrite multiple tracks for every write. Just conventional or HAMR drives for me.

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Re: Helium is tricksy stuff if I recall correctly.

Shingled drives aren't as big an issue if they're intended for WIRE usage (Write Infrequently, Read Extensively). Then the wear-and-tear in the write phase is minimized. HAMR still isn't ready yet, and you have to wonder about the longevity of that heating element.

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Helium Shortage

If we waste helium on things like this what will we fill balloons with? (I vote for hydrogen)

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