back to article AT&T trash talks Google over Fiber fiasco: Leave ISP stuff to the experts

With Google deciding to cut back on its Fiber workforce and reconsidering its plan to deliver broadband service, competing ISPs are cackling with glee at the Chocolate Factory's misfortunes. In a post to the company's public policy blog, AT&T vice president of federal regulatory issues Joan Marsh took a moment to needle Google …

  1. Fazal Majid

    AT&T hasn't even tried

    That's pretty rich, considering AT&T hasn't even tried to bring fiber to its customers, despite pocketing tremendous tax breaks to do so since the 90s. They are happy to starve their rotting infrastructure of investment and milk it for profits, investing is for suckers like Verizon FIOS.

    1. David 132 Silver badge
      Mushroom

      Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

      Does anyone else get the sense that AT&T now accept that they're universally loathed, and revel in it? It's like - they're not even pretending to be likeable anymore.

      "Yes, we're assholes. No, you don't have any choice. Suck it up, losers."

      1. cd

        Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

        SBC was always like that.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

        For Reginistas and movie-goers of a younger age, who weren't around for the "Ma Bell" years when AT&T developed it's attitude towards customers. An attitude that produced this parody:

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2NNZdigSXg

        1. Captain DaFt

          Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

          This one's more to the point: https://youtu.be/CHgUN_95UAw

          1. David 132 Silver badge
            Thumb Up

            Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

            @Captain DaFt - thanks for that link, I chuckled at it!

            I confess I haven't encountered Lily Tomlin before - is it just me, or is she very much in the same mould as Ruby Wax?

        2. a_yank_lurker

          Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

          It got worse during the "Allen & Two Temps" era.

        3. Wade Burchette

          Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

          I was thinking of this: https://youtu.be/oyi_q7hIOmw?t=6m4s

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

        Possibly second only to Comcast. Though to be fair, Comcast are mostly just incompetent bungling greedy sods, rather than overtly evil. They just _seem_ really evil because they're so cavalier about being inept.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

      AT&T has given up on Uverse and is running fiber now. They started right about the time that Verizon quit. They didn't fulfill the commitments from the 90s, but then no one else did either. The government should have made those tax breaks reversible if certain milestones weren't met - their own damn fault for giving away money without any way to get it back for non-performance. Even a first year law student in the first week of classes would know to put that into a contract!

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

      My thoughts exactly. Something distasteful about a bureaucractic monopolist "needling" an innovator who is trying to do their job for them. I don't think Google really cares about being a teleco giant. They just make online products and the telecoms dragging their feet at every turn was making online services not as great as they could be. I hope the rocket scientists at the Chocolate Factory figure out a way to do fiber transfer rates over the air. I also had to laugh at that line about "seeking government favors"... as the government once gave AT&T a legal monopoly.

    4. Aedile

      Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

      That's pretty rich, considering AT&T is responsible for many of the woes Google is experiencing.

      https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160314/09374733901/isps-are-blocking-google-fibers-access-to-utility-poles-california.shtml

      https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160226/05123233718/att-sues-to-keep-google-fiber-competition-out-louisville.shtml

      https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160226/11285433724/att-buying-missouri-state-law-ensuring-broadband-there-continues-to-suck.shtml

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

        Yes, you see how entrenched the telecoms are in the government. Their service is terrible and their prices are too high in the US... but there is little anyone can do to break their stranglehold. The telcos are supposed to be heavily regulated, but their customer service scores rank below drug dealers and their prices are way out of whack with international data rates.... Even Google, with tons of cash and everyone (in government and elsewhere) thinking they are the best company ever, is having difficulty even *getting into the market* to compete because of all the red tape. The red tape which the telecoms, not the government, want in place to protect them against competition. I'm hoping that this lights a fire under Google and they take their Seal Team 6 caliber engineering teams and invent some form of over the air high speed which is just a fraction of the telecoms costs.

    5. jelabarre59

      Re: AT&T hasn't even tried

      investing is for suckers like Verizon FIOS.

      Are you kidding? Verizon FKUPS hasn't invested in their physical plant for a few years or more. If your location doesn't already have VerizonFUKUS it never will.

  2. Mage Silver badge

    But ...

    Google not only cares less, it thinks it should make the rules and own all your personal information.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: But ...

      Enough with that noise. Google was trying to do something awesome here and the regulators working on behalf of the telecoms screwed them at every turn. Google is the only company out there trying to do cool and big new things instead of just shrugging at the status quo. Tech would be a better place with more Googles, not that they are perfect. The telecos are planning to bring people in the US fiber speeds at a quarter to never and still price gouge on rates.

  3. Mikel

    I see that we are counting as proven historical context the unproven and unconfirmed reports of a Google Fiber pullback. Interesting.

  4. gchaze
    Linux

    I worked for google doing underground fiber in Kansas City. ATT was across the street with their fiber and all of a sudden Time-Warner's copper cable plant could supply 100mb/s download speeds. It's amazing how good and relatively cheap internet can be when there is more than one provider.

    I wasn't the first with the youtube links so here are a couple in the same spirit. One is about Comcast but feel free to substitute any big provider's name. I've been known to work in the telecommunications industry as well as suffer as a customer so these are especially "piquant" to me. Some of the language is NOT work appropriate.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMcny_pixDw

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ilMx7k7mso&feature=youtu.be

  5. Mark 85

    AT&T, Comcast, CenturyLink... etc..

    They're all alike... too much alike it would seem. Where I am other than Charter (true cable, not DSL) the competition is CenturyLink (formerly QWest). CenturyLink only offeres DSL and the price is just a bit better than Charter's but the with slower speeds.

    Seems the CenturyLink/QWest people have been promising fiber now for ten years. Usually.. "oh and well have fiber to your house in about a year".. for 10 years now. There's no trucks, no build out going on but they are promising it. There's even ton of dark fiber in many of the newer neighborhoods just waiting... put in when the houses were bujilt as part of the developer's agreement with the city/county. I'd love to see someone actually do something.

  6. Slx

    Some telcos will use terms like "fiber" to describe anything ... 28.8 modem over a POTS line is technically "fiber powered" once it gets past the local central office.

  7. Cuddles

    Leave ISP stuff to the experts

    And if you can't find any of those, let AT&T do it.

  8. Matt Bryant Silver badge
    Stop

    What, never heard of "barriers to market entry?"

    Now, I am no fan of Comcast or AT&T, but reading some of the posts on this thread is just too amusing! The truth is Google made a load of rediculous claims about fibre, about how they were some kind of consumer's white knight, hoped for some "assistance" from the Obama administration, then baulked at actually paying for the rollout. AT&T, Comcast and fellows are laughing because they saw this coming - they know how expensive it is to lay and maintain a network, and they knew they had a good chance of offsetting Google's schmoozing of Obambi with their own political contacts. The sheer cost of entering the market as a national network provider (and long time to break-even in a price war) is what stops competitors just waltzing in and stealing AT&T's and Comcast's lunch. The thing is, Google isn't short of money - if Google really wanted to they could pay for the network, the setup costs, and still underprice the incumbents, it's just it wouldn't be as profitable for them as they want. Despite the profits companies like Comcast make from their productive entities (and TV shows and movies actually cost a lot to make), it is more than matched by the massive chunk of change Google makes just flogging advertising (which costs a lot less to do). So, no, Google didn't "heroically fail", they just decided they could make more money elsewhere.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What, never heard of "barriers to market entry?"

      AT&T didn't pay for that network. They had a legal monopoly going back to the Bell era where they were just guaranteed profits. If they had some cost overruns or hired a million bureaucrats, they just raised costs. Basically works the same way today. They just need to informally coordinate prices with Comcast and a few others. This arrangement is good for no one except the telcos. US data service is worse than most developed, and many developing, nations and still more costly. That's how monopolies work.

      Second, Google isn't expecting Obama to just hand them a network as you seem to imply. They will pay for it. Read the articles. In Nashville, for instance, AT&T and Comcast refuse (and have bogged down in red tape via their government bureaucrat lackeys) access to 44,000 utility poles. Google will pay to install fiber, pay for usage rights, etc, but they are getting a no go from the cigar smoking crowd and their friends in local government... because AT&T and Comcast know there are huge cost efficiencies to be found in their models and don't want the competition. Google isn't asking for a handout. The telecoms are asking for their handout to be continued by not allowing serious competition, because they know Google isn't going to be cool with informal pricing fixing and will sell that fiber at the lowest price economically viable. Google doesn't care if they break even on fiber. They just want online services to work like online services should work. You can argue with their online model if you want (I think it is awesome), but there is no doubt that Google is the good guy in this situation.

  9. Jeffrey Nonken

    I was going to part here about at&t being screaming hypocrites, but Techdirt has already written a better article than I ever could.

    https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160831/07082835399/att-poster-child-government-favoritism-mocks-google-fiber-government-favoritism.shtml

  10. TrumpSucks

    Matt Bryant's comments are spot on - which is why ATT et al suck so much. There just isn't enough competition.

    ATT can barely hook up an internet connection or make a useable website. We really don't need another connection - we just need a decent company in the industry to bring the standards up.

    I have used Comcast, COX, Century Link and AT&T - they all suck shit and are total crooks.

    I also have used broadband in countries where there are many provides in one area - and it is night and day as far as service and price. I paid $15 for fiber in Malaysia and $25 for very, very fast DSL in Seoul.

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