UK's education system blamed for IT jobs going to non-Brits Immigration is an issue swaying electorates around the world, including Britons, who will next week decide whether to leave the European Union and Americans, who will soon decide whether to vote for Donald Trump as president in November. While this is generally assumed to affect low-pay, low-skilled jobs, it can affect those in …
AFAIK in Germany (like in Italy), because degrees have full legal value, you can't use Engineer or Doctor unless you have a valid degree. You may also need to be associated to their "orders", or you may not work legally as such.
In a country like Italy that lead to some complex situations, because for example IT is taught both in the Engineering faculties, and Computer Sciences ones. But while there is an "order" for Engineers (any type), there isn't one for IT professionals which aren't Engineers. Engineers often tried to ensure some jobs required someone part of an "order", to monopolize them - leading to the ridiculous situation where a Civil or Naval Engineer could lead an IT project, but a Computer Science PhD could not (or a mathematician, and so on....). Thereby sometimes it's not so advantageous (unless you're an engineer, of course).
Probably in English engine-er became too close to modern meaning of"engine" (in US aren't you an engineer if you operate a train?), and not only to the Latin "ingegnum" and derivatives, while in other languages that doesn't happen.
In Germany Engineer is a job title on a par with Solicitor or Doctor in terms of respect
This is definitely true, but it is also true (as other comments have mentioned) that here, in England, non-Engineers have been given job titles of Engineer (e.g. Sanitation Engineer, aka the bog cleaner). On the continent, and especially in Germany, an Engineer is pretty much a regulated job title (if not legally, by professional consensus at least), and you must actually be an Engineer to be called an Engineer. They would never even consider calling the people we often call engineers such.
I heard that, not long ago, a survey was done in this country asking who was the most famous engineer they knew of. The most popular answer was Kevin Webster, the character from Coronation Street who is a car mechanic.
Part of the reason, I believe, is actually (strange as it sounds) down to spelling. Engineer conjours up images of engine, dirty things which make noise and break down (especially if you go back to steam engines etc). This leads to thoughts of a mechanic.
In Germany, the word is Ingenieur, which betrays it's roots in the word "Ingenious". This brings to mind thoughts of people coming up with clever new methods of accomplishing a task, which is fundamentally what engineering is. The situation is, I believe, the same in much of Europe, and the simple substitution of an "I" with an "E" is, at least, part of the reason for the denigration of Engineers in this country.
Even worse in Canada. A PhD physicist working for the government I wasn't an exempt (ie professional) employee, so I had to be in the union, had to have fixed working hours, had to clock in an clockout, couldn't sign off on the reports / expenses / HR stuff of the team I was running.
Yet a 21 year old "environmental engineer" with a degree in sustainable development is automatically my boss.
There is an exemption to allow professors who aren't engineers to supervise PhD students but it expires and the engineers are fighting it in court.
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Firstly all your points about Engineering are only true in some disciplines, if you look at Chartered Chemical Engineering as a datum then I can understand your view point.
Firstly where there is not a recognised and required chartering body in control of standards for a discipline then the Universities get to choose what an Engineering degree is and of course they are now out only for profit. Without the Engineering body in control of what is and is not a Engineering degree then a UK Engineering degree in that subject is one only in name.
Secondly in the subjects where being Chartered is a requirement for a project getting signed off then companies in that field will have at least one Chartered Engineer or they could not work in the field. They would employ whomever was cheapest if they could but because they are required to have a chartered Engineer to get the insurance they have to pay and recruit people with recognised qualificaitons.
Thirdly the Chartering body wants and needs to keep upping the standard to maintain high wages and recognition for its members, this means that the standards for certified qualifications also increase and so we have a loop where the Chartering body and it's members are in control of the discipline rather than employers.
There is more ofc but the point is that where being a Chartered Engineer in IT is not a requirement for signing off on projects then it is just another BS qualification. Now you might say that isn't fair but then again who says the degree you hold proves your competence is at the same level as say Chartered Chemical Engineer?
The subject that is now IT has been deskilled over and again since it was Computer Science, back in the '70s you would be expected to build a computer from scratch and then write the OS and applications if you wanted to be called an Systems Engineer. Now however most UK IT degrees don't bother with the mathematics or electronics or even recognise the science elements that IT is based upon hence you get a loop in the opposite direction, namely the continued devaluation and deskilling of the work force and the whole subject.
This is why in IT faulty/insecure code and electronics is okay in finalised products simply because the people in control of the subject are not interested in the people who work in it. So yes in the UK, Chartered Engineer in IT is not really worth the effort until enough people die and sue the industry sufficiently for them to be force to actually have standards. This sadly is what it will take for a meaningful computing qualification to come about after years of bad hardware and software being acceptable.
Until you are favourably comparable with John von Neumann then you are just the amateur everyone wants you to be and you should be happy you have a job in this field at all.
"The term Engineer has been used to represent technicians and general workers for such a long time that the title has no real status in the UK. As others have stated, on the continent an Engineer is held in high regard to the same status as a doctor or lawyer".
In Europe, "Engineer" is a protected title, but it isn't in the UK. I've been a Chartered Engineer for 18 years but I'll have to sign up with FEANI for that fact to be recognised in mainland Europe.
I've absolutely no idea if Brexit would affect the 30-odd UK engineering bodies who are members, though.
Where to start... Yes there is a snobbery which isn't helped by plumbers calling themselves engineers. Plumbing is a perfectly honourable and well-paid profession. They don't engineer boilers although it could be argued that they have to engineer the networks that connect them to their clients (i.e. rads).
What's more pertinent is the fact that engineering and computing degrees are difficult and the prospects are entering an industry which is being decimated by bean counters who believe that those in IT just click buttons and whose jobs can be done by someone with loads of dubious qualifications from another country.
I don't think the education system has much to do with it. When I went to university back in the early 90s, schools' IT departments were barely functional and pupils were actively encouraged to not use the computers in case they broke them. Getting into an engineering degree wasn't too difficult. The degree was, however, and I can't help comparing myself with my wife who came out of uni with a good arts degree, having spent most of her time watching daytime TV, walked into a finance job and earns double what I do.
Why the hell anyone would want to get into the IT industry is beyond me. Until companies actually start going under because of the way their IT capability is being destroyed and people are held responsible for their actions then nothing is going to change.
As for the Brexit debate, this has absolutely nothing to do with it. It's the people in government here who are responsible. They're the ones being "lobbied" (the gentle western term for bribery) by big business to make sure short-term gain and bonuses are inflated at the expense of anyone and anything that gets in the way.
What's more pertinent is the fact that engineering and computing degrees are difficult and the prospects are entering an industry which is being decimated by bean counters who believe that those in IT just click buttons and whose jobs can be done by someone with loads of dubious qualifications from another country.
In a recent meeting with a client, I had to explain the difference between a software developer/programmer and a software engineer. They hadn't a clue (they were business types), and I found it difficult to put it into words, but my analogy seemed to work:
- The programmer is the builder, operating to someone else's technical designs to erect* the building.
- The software engineer is the civil engineer, who takes pretty pictures from an architect and makes them into a functioning, structurally sound design. He must consider effects on and from the surroundings, possible extreme conditions, and a variety of other data to ensure the building will be safe.
Actually, often the software engineer will also be the builder and the architect, but the analogy still stands in principal.
* Tee hee
Hmm, I am not convinced by that analogy.
I think a programmer should be doing what Dr. Mouse said a software engineer does, and I think it is would be a dysfunctional shop in which those two roles, as described, are separate.
So I don't really trust the term "software engineer", I am not surprised if someone else doesn't understand it, and I don't think they would be able to explain the difference to a third person else based on those definitions.
@Count Ludwig
I know a heck of a lot of programmers who do nothing but write code. They do not understand the system they are developing, or the adjacent systems. They cannot see from a user's point of view, factor in necessary integrations with other systems etc. They cannot understand the basic networking or infrastructure on which the system must run. They take a detailed plan from someone else, and translate it into code in whatever language they know, oblivious to anything else.
Maybe this is me trying to put things in boxes again. I used to maintain a very clear distinction between "friend" and "mate". I had lots of mates, people I would go drinking with or have a laugh with. I had very few friends, the people who I trusted completely, would be there for in an instant and who would do the same for me.
Software engineer fits better, to me (a qualified mechanical and electronic engineer) because what is being done is engineering. Programming is just one skill a software engineer must have, but they must also be able to plan, consider side effects, understand interactions with infrastructure, etc.
"They take a detailed plan from someone else, and translate it into code in whatever language they know, oblivious to anything else."
You seem to imply thats a simple job. If the plan entails a list of items how would you store them in memory? A linked list? Array? B-tree? Hash? Depends on the insert, search & delete patterns the data will be subject to doesn't it. Similarly if you have a time critical multitasking program would you go multithreaded, multiprocess, a combination of the 2 or would you go serial with i/o multiplexing? Programming is complex - its an art and a science, and its a lot more than just "doing nothing but writing code" as if they're just scribbling stuff on a keyboard in a zombie fashion being spoon fed by some spec. I've had specs that were literally one page to describe the entire system and I've had to work from that.
Understanding the business you're in is important, but ultimately most business processes are pretty similar in my experience - its all just number twiddling in the end. Its FAR more important to know how to translate a business requirement into a working program. After all, thats what we're paid to do.
Fair enough. I agree that some specs are barely more than "We need a website" or "We need an app".
I guess the analogy is not completely accurate, as there are several layers to the design, from the way it interacts with other systems to how data is stored and accessed, so the programmer can be essential to the design process.
I have still met more than my share of monkeys who can write C# when spoon fed what to do and how to do it, and no more.
It's called teamwork.
A programmer must focus, an engineer has to tie the details together.
It's not two functions which can be sensibly multi-tasked by one person, unless your name is Marvin and you have a "brain the size of a planet"
According to the media we're all just "coders" now anyway... and "coding" is easy, so get on it kids!!
Personally I prefer being described as a Software Engineer... it fits what I do daily, and my mentality, which is to try and build/fix complex systems as simply and elegantly as possible - can given the time/resource constraints.
'Where to start... Yes there is a snobbery which isn't helped by plumbers calling themselves engineers..'
The thing is, it wasn't the plumbers who started that ball rolling..all the plumbers I know still call themselves plumbers, nothing else (whereas we call them pipe monkeys...)
Where it (plumbers are really, really engineers too!) started?, I've no idea, I always put it down to an attempted massaging of figures for league tables (at at stroke, the number of 'engineers' in good old Blighty must have at least quintupled..I must do a bit of digging).
'..Plumbing is a perfectly honourable and well-paid profession. They don't engineer boilers although it could be argued that they have to engineer the networks that connect them to their clients (i.e. rads).'
Aye, though I could show you pictures of boiler-radiator 'notworks' which would make you weep (especially if I told you the hourly rates of the installers and how long they took), as to the 'service engineers' who come to fix borked boilers...they're not even technicians..card and valve monkeys..
'..What's more pertinent is the fact that engineering and computing degrees are difficult and the prospects are entering an industry which is being decimated by bean counters who believe that those in IT just click buttons and whose jobs can be done by someone with loads of dubious qualifications from another country.'
Bingo!
'..Why the hell anyone would want to get into the IT industry is beyond me. Until companies actually start going under because of the way their IT capability is being destroyed and people are held responsible for their actions then nothing is going to change.'
I'm one of those who saw the writing on the wall a while back, and even though I'm still getting pestered by contacts and agencies about IT jobs and consultancy, I'm bloody well not going back. They royally pissed me off one time too many in my last couple of IT jobs (minor example, got rather sick of other people being promoted on the back of my work), and as a consequence they've permanently lost someone with 30 years hardware/software/admin experience, besides, I'm actually enjoying what I'm currently doing (and yes, even though it still does involve IT 'stuff', that's SEFP!).
As far as IT related matters are concerned, I'm not fossilizing, far from it, but anything I do from now on is for my personal amusement and edification only, fsck them all.
Engineer has been devalued, we should take it back and give it the recognition it deserves. I recently saw a sign on a toilet cubicle in a large bank stating "...the toilet was broken but an Engineer had been called."
£ is another reason why non-Brits are doing IT. How many are from the sub-continent here on visas doing IT jobs but for a lot less than local hires cost?
Coupled with a tale of qualified people being replaced by (cheap) unqualified people.
Does not compute.
Perhaps instead the education system should focus on lying about your abilities and purchasing bogus foreign qualifications. Knowing that then you would be eminently employable and also be paid whilst receiving one to one tuition from an industry expert. Far more effective than an abstract degree course.
Lack of qualified people. Coupled with a tale of qualified people being replaced by (cheap) unqualified people. Does not compute.
Yes it does.
There is no law that hinders a business to take bad decisions and go under as a consequence.
Nor should there be.
Capitalism! It's worth trying!
The focus on IT in the article is inevitable ( this is El Reg after all) but it's too narrow.
Middle class aspiration ( and schools themselves perhaps) is to aim for traditional subjects and professions.
Vocational and professional degrees ( or A levels) other than law/medicine/accountancy are seen as being second best choices. Often at new universities rather then Russel Group ones, or poor relations within them.
It's not a new thing either.
Thirty odd years ago I did my PGCE at a very well regarded education department in a mid-range uni. Education students were crammed into an old house away from the campus. We had ancient equipment, tiny library etc.
The mediocre law and medicine departments had premises and equipment we could only dream about.
I got an A level in computer studies some thirty odd years ago, which gave me a broad insight into the world of computing circa 1960. Admittedly many things stay the same, but the changes that had occurred and were occurring put my education on a par with learning how to nap flint a century after bronze had taken over.
Since then, everything I know, has been gleaned from books, the net and an unswerving enthusiasm to suck up knowledge. Can I get a job in IT? No way! Can I find a programming course that would give me the bits of paper to wave at an employer? Nope. Can my local college help? You're kidding.
Sure, a heaving wallet can buy anything, but if I had a heaving wallet, why on Earth would I be going headlong into an industry that treats its staff as a temporary nuisance.
Today, I apply for Excel / VBA oriented jobs, even going as far as to offer my services on a "not happy don't pay" basis, but still I languish on the sidelines raging at the screen when another article citing the lack of IT skills in the workplace is stunting UK businesses outlook.
I feel your pain. I'm beginning to think there is something rotten in the heart of UK HR departments. Over the last two years I've found it harder and harder to get new contracts despite the fact Ive got 25 years experience in a wide range of industries. I've been a BOFH, I've worked on helpdesks, lead agile and waterfall teams, developed in Ada, Fortran, C++, written midlets for mobile phones and created applications that are still being used 15 years later etc ad nauseum.
I can't get new gigs for technical roles. In the end I had to bite the bullet and become a PM. No disrespect to PMs but I bloody hate it. I'm very obviously doing some wrong with my c.v as I was not even getting interviews. I'd understand it if I was failing at the interview but I can't even get that far. The feedback was getting ridiculous - "oh you don't have enough experience with javascript" , or "we want someone with five years experience of MS TFS" . so now my working life is reduced to writing GANTT charts and chivvying developers to do a job that I could do myself better and quicker. Yes I know I sound bitter. That's because I am - old and bitter and pissed off. I still code but in the evenings and weekends and it can be hard to fit in around work and family life.
And at my current job, the developer leads complain they cannot get enough staff - yet when you ask further, it turns out they aren't recruiting in the UK - they get in people from France and Spain. They don't train anyone, they don't run an apprenticeship scheme and they complain that they can't keep the staff for more than a year or two. Unbelievable.
That's because I am - old and bitter and pissed off.
Well, HR lie about not disciminating, but there's something they'll hold against you given half a chance, your age, law or no law. The twats that run HR in my large multi-national actually used the words internally to describe our workforce as "pale, male and stale". Because apparently it's OK to hold those things against the people. that the same fuckwitted HR team have over the years recruited.
But rather than try and change with world, you could perhaps try adding a disability to your CV and see if that gets a different result?
I have to agree, this isnt just an IT related problem; Universities are shutting down expensive to run engineering and "science" courses to run cheap "media studies" courses; and ALL the courses are pared down to meet the exam, not teach the subject (which is sadly true through-out our education system now).
I have had freshly minted degree qualified staff turn up who havent a clue outside of the very narrow band of information spoon-fed to them, and who seem incapable of realising their lack.
My favourite stories in this vein are :-
A newly qualified teacher who asked me if Apple Crumble was vegetarian, and couldnt give the seasons in the correct order ("Summer, Winter, Autumn, Spring" is what I caught her teaching the children)
A boss with a degree in Electrical Engineering, who miss-wired the plug in his table lamp - Earth and Neutral crossed - and couldnt see the problem with a bank of CBs with both the "In" and "Out" cables coming out of the one set of terminals.
To be fair to him, I was the first person to notice the issue - on my first day in the job - 23 years after they had been installed!!
We had an electrical engineer who was having problems with ignition interference on his car radio. He asked us if putting a suppression capacitor ( the type for use on ignition systems) on his aerial feed would cure the interference, we said it would.
Funny, he never came back to say whether it had worked or not.
Lack of exposure to coding?
When every child around here has a mobile/tablet and a copy of minecraft on it?
The reason children (and middle class helicopter parents) dont do coding or engineering is because its bloody hard....and .. wait for it.... badly paid, plus you'll never have a job for life since every tom, dick and bank will outsource their entire IT department to god knows where at the slightest chance of the directors not getting a fat bonus this year.
But companies will always say "we cant get anyone in to do vital IT work"... not surprising really when they dont want to pay for it, or indeed train any of their current staff to do IT work , after all, they'll just ask for a pay rise.
So its bribe(lobby) the government to either blow more money on trying to train people or relax the visa paperwork so you can get in someone happy to run a multi-billion dollar banking network for £15 000/pa
Oh and as someone who works at the sharp end of real engineering(aerospace metal bashing) its clear some "qualified engineers" need their CAD terminals taken away and given crayons instead ....
"When every child around here has a mobile/tablet and a copy of minecraft on it?"
I'm not sure what that has to do with coding.
The kids are clever about using those gadgets, no doubt at all, but coding? I don't think so.
But "not surprising really when they don't want to pay for it" there you are 100% spot-on.
Back in the day when I was contracting, I lost count of the number of companies where you would hear the sharp intake of breath if you suggested any rate over £10 an hour - and this for a fully-qualified MCSE with loads of experience and a good track history of project delivery. "What?", they would say, "you want more than the guy who fills the vending machine? No chance, matey."
As they sow, so shall they reap.
But it's a bit hard on the new generation who can't get into the industry because of the overseas slave-wages no-overheads no-employment-law competition.
>> The kids are clever about using those gadgets, no doubt at all, but coding? I don't think so.
No, they goddamn aren't.
The use them as toys and complain to dad when something does not work as expected, any attempts to try to show them how anything works is met with a "meh".
A tablet uses so many abstractions as to not need to know how a file system works or what a file is any more.
Do not confuse kids learning how to have fun quickly with a device with understanding the devices themselves.
Next time you see a 12-15 year old using a computer, pretend you know nothing and then ask them to do anything simple.
Reposting due to great success: Kids can't use computers... and this is why it should worry you
Abstract: TL;DR? Why not just go watch another five second video of a kitten with its head in a toilet roll, or a 140 character description of a meal your friend just stuffed in their mouth. "nom nom". This blog post is not for you.
I'm working at a start-up in Cambridge where we pay mid-range salaries and need experienced people, and the majority of the software team are non-UK citizens, and the majority of the CVs we get sent by agencies for the open positions we have are also from non-UK citizens. We're in a city where the market for experienced software engineers is competitive, so one reason may be that the good UK engineers go to the bigger companies with the deeper pockets, but there doesn't seem to be the pool of talent in this country that there once was.
True, and we're looking to move above "mid-range" as much as we can given budgetary constraints, but you're not going to find many start-ups offering top-end salaries (that you would still expect to be around in a year's time), and there are advantages to balance against that - more interesting work, developing new stuff instead of maintaining dreadful ancient crufty code, being part of an emerging industry, future potential, share options, etc.
I guess the point could be that there is a shortage of new talent, and maybe the majority of the UK people are going for the safer, better paid options than taking a risk on something new that may or may not pay off later, whereas experienced people from Europe are more willing to take a punt over here given the more limited options at home.
Gender balance is also interesting - CVs from female UK candidates are unicorn-like in rarity, but slightly more likely to come in from abroad (although still a tiny percentage).
>good UK engineers go to the bigger companies with the deeper pockets
Good UK engineers go to the US, work remotely for companies in the US or RoW, contract for big crappy Java dinosaurs, or head into finance in the City.
Those are literally the only ways to earn good money in the UK.
Plus startups that pay decently. All three of them.
Everyone else is on "£15k - if you're lucky - to write JavaScript" wages.
And I work in an established company in Cambridge, where salaries probably count as mid-range; and we can't get enough software developers of acceptable quality, whether from the UK, the EU, or further afield. I don't get the impression that offering higher pay would make much difference; there simply aren't enough good developers available.
<rant>There are good developers in the UK available. However you require 1st* from Oxbridge to work in Cambridge, even if your job requires 10 years experience. Everything can change in ten years.</rant>
Ho hum.
* I got a Desmond from some college in the Fens twenty years ago.
I found too many companies look for "pre cooked" personnel. They don't want to spend time and some money in training good "juniors" with a lot of potential, often fearing they could leave once trained (if you don't pay enough later, and the environment is bad, they of course will do).
Thus they look for "seniors" who often are just people who embellish their CV knowing recruiting companies aren't able to sort the good from the bad, and just match keywords. That happens too with off-shored personnel.
It was already pointed out school and universities can't prepare people for very specific tasks in each company. Maybe it was possible in the past, when "engineering" meant just a few specific area. IT encompass a lot of different one, being across each and every commercial and non commercial activity.
It is correct they teach those skills upon which students can then build upon - but companies should be ready to train the people they need in their specific sector, and then be still compelling enough so people stay around.
After our HR sent us a lot of people "fit on paper", but utterly unfit on the real job (I do real "hands-on" tests, not just interviews...) - I asked them to look for people with the basic skill needed, good potential, and truly interested in our area. We'll train them.
'..I do real "hands-on" tests, not just interviews...'
Every place where I've been asked for my 'input' into the hiring process, this is my first suggestion, and usually falls on deaf ears.
I'd hate to tally up the amount of time I've spent over the years fixing all the nonsense that a simple 20 minute practical test at the interview stage would have prevented..
This just doesn't apply to IT, a friend who is a joiner has a rather simple 'filter' test he uses at interview for 'helpers', he gives them a nail, hammer and two lumps of wood..to use his words 'it's really fucking depressing to live on a planet where that many people fail to fix two bits of wood together with a hammer and nail..and yet they think that's ok because I'll let them use a Paslode?'
'..I asked them to look for people with the basic skill needed, good potential, and truly interested in our area. We'll train them.'
You have a better than average HR department if they actually do that, I've been told by my PHB that If I had actually applied to do the job that I'm currently doing, I wouldn't have even gotten to the interview stage, our HR department would have filtered me out (I lack the relevant paper qualifications and nepotistic connections).
there simply aren't enough good developers available.
There are loads of good developers available.
That their CVs aren't getting to your desk implies at least one of the following :-
The latter does seem to correlate rather strongly with using recruitment agencies...
Vic.
It's a vicious cycle, over the last 15 years, very large numbers of qualified and experienced IT staff have been let go and replaced by cheaper, practically unskilled, offshore labour. Who in their right mind would study and get IT qualifications knowing that they will be practically unemployable if they want a decent wage.
So now, we get the situation where people from overseas, of very variable quality, are employed because we don't have the skills locally (despite it only being a matter of a few months training with a decent person to get them to a superior level) but the skills aren't available locally only because the general perception is that all the jobs go to cheaper people overseas.
"And I work in an established company in Cambridge, where salaries probably count as mid-range; and we can't get enough software developers of acceptable quality .... simply aren't enough good developers available."
What you mean is that you can't get any people who can afford to live in Cambridge on the wages you're offering.
Intra Company Transfers are what really hit the UK job market, in London the salaries seemed to drop by about £10k a year and the contract market almost died at one point, started out at around 18,000 offshore workers brought in a year, 10 or so years ago, was apparently 33,000 last year, I left the UK 6 years ago because of this, UK Government's (Labour and Tory) fully support ICT as this 2010 article shows:
http://www.techeye.net/business/uk-big-business-exploits-visa-loophole-to-decimate-it-jobs
as this later article states:
"Workers were hopeful that the influence of the electorate could at least chip into the stranglehold of lobbyists and big business when the government considered a review. Unfortunately for them, their hopes seem to have been dashed by chancellor George Osborne, who attended the India-UK Joint Economic and Trade Committee (JETCO) with Shri Anand Sharma, India’s Commerce, Industry and Textiles Minister. Vince Cable also attended.
Both parties agreed that there would be a push in investment between the two countries. With this came an agreement that the UK would not alter any of the existing Intra Company Transfer visa laws at least for the next two years. According to a statement issued on the government of India’s Press Information Bureau (PIB), the Coalition also agreed that there would be no salary cap on the transfers. "
http://www.techeye.net/business/uk-it-workers-betrayed-by-george-osborne
Computer Weekly also explained how the scam works:
http://www.computerweekly.com/blog/Investigating-Outsourcing/Offshore-IT-workers-in-the-UK-avoid-paying-taxes-but-are-not-breaking-the-law
This issue is pretty much ignored by the media now after a flurry of publicity earlier, can't see the Government or business changing their ways though, they want cheap, even if it's useless.
>While this is generally assumed to affect low-pay, low-skilled jobs, it can affect those in IT too.
Trump and a Brexit will harm low-pay, low-skilled jobs for different reasons ...
Trump is a republican, akin to Conservatives and New Labour in the UK or LR and PS in France, all they want is to enrich their already rich friends, they have zero incentive to do otherwise ... that means low-pay gets even lower-pay (cf zero-hour contract in the UK).
A Brexit will not stop EU Europeans (Poles, Czechs etc) from entering the UK to work, that simply is a lie (unless you "really" wanna break treaties, in which case you will have some serious economic troubles, they will NOT allow you to pick and choose once more), what it will do, though, is cause many multinational businesses to move over to the continent... Besides, all the migrants from outside the EU who are currently in France will end up in the UK, because France has said: Brexit means we send them over!
IT will be especially affected by a Brexit. Either way, I do not care, I no longer live in the UK and could not care less what you decide doing ... I'll never go back anyway ;-).
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