DEATH fails to end mobile contract: Widow forced to take HUBBY's ASHES into shop A widow was forced to take direct action against a T-Mobile shop after it repeatedly demanded payments for her dead husband's mobile. Maria Raybould from Cardiff, Wales, arrived at the store with her hubby's ashes in an effort to stop T-Mobile from continuing to charge £26 per month by direct debit for a Samsung Galaxy Mini …
I can understand that the shop asked for proof, I'm sure there are some people out there who think and have tried to use that as a way to get out of a contract.
Granted that there is a lot to organise and many to inform when someone dies.
However, a less dramatic way would have been to show the death certificate rather than taking the ashes round.
I had a similar problem with my old national monopoly, before I left the country they cancelled the telephone a month early (luckily I had just set up VoIP). But then continued to bill for the internet even though I had left the country. Every month they would bill me, I would phone they would reimburse me then do the same, with a late charge, the next month. The moment I said that I was going to complain to the national regulator with that person's name on the complaint - it stopped...
Since then I've been on PAYG where I can - there's no contract to abuse!
I left the country, gave a month's notice and then cancelled the direct debit. It was quite amusing to watch what happened next, although they did resolve it without the need for a dead body. I even got a bit of a refund.
I have no problem with automatic systems provided I have control of the off switch.
In the UK there is a system called the Direct Debit Guarantee, under which all erroneous bills can be refunded in full within about 48hrs upon calling your bank to invoke the guarantee. They sorted it for me within about 15 minutes, and I wasn't on hold for long. You then have to afterward liaise with the company which billed you though.
Oh and you can shut off the automatic payment 100% just by going to your online bank account and cancelling the Direct Debit. Although some companies may get a bit upset at that.
Agree on the Direct Debit thing. Just phone the bank and cut them off at source. When they call to complain, then you aren't money-down to fight them.
Had to do this with Three, who billed me for a contract phone (and contract) that never arrived. I only knew it hadn't arrived when I phoned up to ask where it was (28 days later). I asked them THERE AND THEN to block the IMEI / SIM. They asked me for the number. I called them idiots, in a roundabout way (how the hell do *I* know what phone you sent me?).
Weeks later they were still billing me. So I phoned my bank. They made it clear what I was doing but they cannot refuse to do it. I cancelled the DD. Minutes later I had a phone call from Three demanding "their" money back. The bank had cancelled AND REFUNDED all the DD payments. That got Three's attention. It didn't stop them trying to get the money though, however my offer to initiate their threatened lawsuit on their behalf finally made the lightbulbs in their head come on, I think. Eventually they sent me a letter where they had "decided to take no further action". Strange, because I'd decided exactly the opposite if they had continued to harass me.
But the banks and DD? Wow. Most co-operative my bank has EVER been.
"Direct Debit Guarantee, under which all erroneous bills can be refunded in full within about 48hrs upon calling your bank "
Unless you set up your DD with a credit card, in which case you can not cancel the DD, only the company you have the DD with can do it.
Reporting the card stolen usually fix that. However, the first step is ratting out the people charging your card for "fraudulent charges" (you have a copy of the paper letter requesting they stop, and the receipt for sending it?).
"They" fear this: If the bankier cartel find that there is just too much bother with someone's credit card processing facility, they will get blacklisted - Globally.
"Unless you set up your DD with a credit card, in which case you can not cancel the DD, only the company you have the DD with can do it."
That, too, can be dealt with. I was trying to terminate a phone service, and the company was being unhelpful. So, I called my credit card company and we had a little discussion about withdrawing authorisation. I granted the authorisation, so I can withdraw it, simple. Unfortunately, they disagreed, so I terminated the credit card account.
Of course, it's important to do this before any disputed money has been transferred. If you're trying to get back the cash they've overcharged you, you're probably buggered. Which, to return to the topic of the article, is difficult when there are unexpected changes in circumstances.
Have you noticed how often it is that the account termination part of a billing system is badly designed? It's almost as if it were intentional...
Here in U.S., the cell phone company continues to bill you and ruins your credit rating while you write letters to the Public Service Commission. They in turn forward your letters back to the cell phone company who turns the matter over for collection. You are forbidden from taking them to court, by law, and your only option is to enter arbitration in front of an arbitrator who is hired by the cell phone company you are fighting with.
Resistance is futile.
Muppets entering data confirmed to be muppets.
This happened to me with virgin mobile. I cancelled the contract, then a full month after the payments should have stopped I cancelled the direct debit.
They set up a brand new contact on a new number after I cancelled and ported my number away to another provider. This is what was billed for. Then, even though they had my original number, didn't think that calling me on it might resolve the issue of payment immediately.
At best, muppets. At worst, scam artists. Damaged my credit rating as well.
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Does this not depend on what sort of account. A joint account (for example) would continue to operate. Had the account been frozen, the phone company couldn't take payments.
I agree. First port of call - phone the bank, cancel the DD. Second port of call, recorded delivery letter with a copy of death certificate.
If they want to pursue it after that, then let them TRY to enforce it, they wont get far.
This case illustrates something we see over and over again in modern life - Customer service fell out of the window in the race to the bottom.
Frank N. Stein - you realise that you paying your bills manually would have no bearing on this situation, the issue is that his bill hasn't been paid (because he is dead) we are not told if thats because his account has been closed cancelling the DD or if his cremation has had a detrimental affect on him posting cheques...
Either way, using a direct debit or paying manually would not change this situation.
A lesson a former employer of mine learned the hard way.
He had a 'key person' insurance policy, with the monthly premiums to be automatically deducted from the company's account.
The insurance company screwed up, and, in the first month, deducted 12 months worth of premiums. While that did hurt financially, he assumed that that would be the end of it, and the policy was paid for the full one year term.
But, NO, they insurance company did it again in the second month, deducting 11 months worth of premiums. Now that DID hurt financially (employees did NOT get their paychecks because of it). Insurance agent was less than useless, and the insurance company was busy offering explanations, and excuses, But we had to wait on the refund.
They did it again in the third month, taking out 10 months worth of premiums. Since our bookkeeper was "expecting that it might happen again"; she kept watch on the bank balance, and on the day that automatic deduction tried to post, we hit the bank with am order to refuse to honor the deduction, and not to allow any further deductions from that company.
Soon afterward, we got a new insurance agent, and transferred away the usual business insurance policies away from the old agent, kissing that agent "goodbye" when the term of the 'key person' policy expired.
Lesson learned - YOU control WHO gets paid, and WHEN, not some scumbag company!!!
Sorry but if you don't run businesses as numbers exercises at some level, they just won't exist.
The problem here isn't that though. It's a single shop manager failing to follow procedure and also being a total dick/bastard, and others not taking responsibility for ensuring T-Mobile's billing systems behaved in the right way, and the different departments being in total silos without any insight into each others' processes or priorities. Underfunding/mismanaging the integration of systems may be in some part responsible, and, yes, un-empathy may play a role in that.
Ever thought perhaps the shop owner's been stung once before with someone weaseling their way out of a contract without penalty by faking his/her own death, thus making him "once bitten, twice shy"? It may sound ridiculous, but modern society tells us not everything is taboo to everyone.
... others not taking responsibility for ensuring T-Mobile's billing systems behaved in the right way, ...
Billing systems are like wast piles of manure, crufty COBOL/JPL-software left to ferment for decades on long obsolete mainframe technology, with some cholera-effluent added on top (WebSphere, Java) - by an intractable number of con-slut-ants in Bombay or where ever it is people will work for rice & biscuits this financial year!
Nobody knows what "the right thing" is any more, the ones who perhaps did are retired or dead.
"Sick"
Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence.
I'm willing to bet every single person she spoke to completely understood the issue passed it to the next department to deal with who understood the issue but had to pass it on to another department who completely understood but...
Big companies, lots of moving parts, no cohesion between them!
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Correct me if I'm wrong but small claims excludes the possibility of claiming for solicitors' fees; and solicitors' fees are only claimable in relation to a specific form of action (e.g. breach of contract) which you sued on and won, and where the court then felt you ought to be awarded fees, over and above just "litigant in person" (£9ph) fees.
So you need a specific action to sue under, but to do that you have to show you've exhausted all reasonable modes of dealing with it, including alternative dispute resolution methods, i.e. going to the industry arbitration (CISAS) panel after requesting a deadlock letter (but has to be within 6 months of grounds for complaint arising in case of CISAS. Also not sure if they deal with pure billing issues).
The ultimate case and authority of course is Ferguson v British Gas http://www.5rb.com/case/ferguson-v-british-gas-trading-ltd/
EE, and now I've discovered 3 as well, shops do not appear to have the authority to do anything at all, other than sell you a phone. Any problem? 'Ring our Indian call centre', who will then, allegedly, authorise a repair or exchange but will argue to death to avoid doing so, expect to waste an hour on the phone. On the rare occasion they agree to an action and if you go back to the shop as instructed (sometimes they arrange a collection) the shop staff have no idea and refuse, for example in my case, to accept a return (for repair). Ring back and they'll tell you oh they should have! They behave like two companies, one with shop fronts here, and the other an Indian half, that barely know how the other works and with the Indian half conveniently holding the balance of power, out of reach in effect. Rubbish service from all providers, that lead me to go Pay as you go, which has saved me a packet, buy the phone for £400 and paying for calls has saved me loads, my monthly call/data spend has been less than £5.
Shops are just for selling, not support.
EE, and now I've discovered 3 as well, shops do not appear to have the authority to do anything at all, other than sell you a phone
Agreed! Vodaphone here in Spain does not appear to have any of their own shops; they all seem to be franchises. So when you make a contract or buy a phone any after sales service has to be done on their worse than useless customer service lines or online. Either way they will continue to bill you while they are doing nothing to provide you with any kind of service.
The worst is if you try to finish a contract even if it is at an end, they will bill you and the stupid banks will keep paying even after you have told them in writing not to.
It may be best to actually die on the premises of the shop if you have any idea it is coming but make sure you leave your wallet at home.
The worst is if you try to finish a contract even if it is at an end, they will bill you and the stupid banks will keep paying even after you have told them in writing not to.
You have to go online, cancel the direct debit, and then ignore further direct debits from that company. As soon as you put a human being in the middle then that's when problems start which is quite odd as I'm sure they can manage to cancel their own direct debits without any problem.
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