Ignoring People is Rude, Shock Study Reveals
It took a "professor" of business gibberish to figure that out?
In a meeting with a woman? For pity's sake don't read this
Are you reading this on a small gizmo or gadget of some kind? Take a look around, my friend. Are you in a meeting, a luncheon, or some other situation of that kind? Are there ladies present (other than yourself, should you happen to be one?) If so - stop reading now, put away your fondleslab or mobe (don't just lay it down, …
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Monday 28th October 2013 08:41 GMT Anonymous Coward
Listen
If a woman is present they like you to swoon and fawn over them, they expect it, you get more out if it of you ask her about herself and feign interest, let her speak and tell you about herself. They love it because it gives the impression that you are interested in them. Keep your mouth shut nod a few times an smile.
Then nip off to the toilet text your mates and tell them you have not only pulled but are about to score.
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Monday 28th October 2013 12:46 GMT Hollerith 1
Re: Listen
I hope I am not working in the company you work for. I have worked alongside guys with your attitude and, believe me, them looking at their mobes is a relief from having their attention on the room of men and women, because women are not stupid: they know that you have contempt for them and are a liar, and it causes considerable tension in the room, but as if, say, a racist were sitting alongside us.
We'd rather you just nipped off to the toilets at the start and start your usual brag, because of course we would believe a bro like you about a ho like them.
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Monday 28th October 2013 06:17 GMT jake
Speaking as a techno-nerd male ...
... I never have any electronic attractions "alive and available" when in meetings that might lead to money. Only stands to reason ... Pay attention to the person you are face-to-face with. And the contract you are trying to hammer out. Outside distractions are contra-indicated.
!GooMyFaceYouMsTwit really isn't important in such scenarios. Nor are telephone calls from your spouse/sprog/beer-buddies, who should all understand that you are at work.
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Monday 28th October 2013 06:38 GMT LaeMing
Re: Speaking as a techno-nerd male ...
Heh.... Some people are positively shocked when my mum (definitely NOT a techno-nerd - though she does use Linux :-P) reveals in conversation she won't idly call her children at work, because they are at work to do work (/real/ emergencies excepting, obviously). Some people apparently honestly can't get their heads around the idea that other people have their own things to do!
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Monday 28th October 2013 15:57 GMT Paul Hovnanian
Re: Speaking as a techno-nerd male ...
"if you must be available."
There's another interesting take on social interaction. Those who "must be available" are often lower on the corporate pecking order. When the phone rings, it might be a superior. And you'd better take the call. Important people tend to be in charge of (and in control of) their own time. When the phone rings, it can go to voice mail. Or your staff can handle it.
Status impresses everyone, particularly women. And they seem to understand this social dynamic to a greater degree than many men do.
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Monday 28th October 2013 06:49 GMT WhoaWhoa
Re: Speaking as a techno-nerd male ...
"Speaking as a techno-nerd male ...
... I never have any electronic attractions "alive and available" when in meetings that might lead to money. Only stands to reason ... Pay attention to the person you are face-to-face with. And the contract you are trying to hammer out. Outside distractions are contra-indicated."
Would that be a "money is the only thing that matters to me so if you're not bringing any please f*ck *ff now because I've got better things to do" sort of techno-nerd male?
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Monday 28th October 2013 12:41 GMT big_D
Re: @ WhoaWhoa (was:Speaking as a techno-nerd male ...)
Even company email and SMS aren't that important, or the person would ring up. You are in a meeting for a reason, it should be requiring your full attention - otherwise, what the hell are you doing at the meeting!
If it is really important, they will call, get your mailbox and will then call the central number and if it really is important, somebody will pull you out of the meeting.
In such a situation, it shows the customer that you are not distracted and you are taking them seriously. And if you are pulled out of the meeting, then they should appreciate that if there really is an emergency, then it takes top priority. That is reassuring; on the one hand they feel a little snubbed, because you had to leave, on the other hand, they feel more secure, because they know, that if it was them that had a big problem, that you would also drop everything to ensure that their needs are met.
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Monday 28th October 2013 13:03 GMT bigtimehustler
Re: @ WhoaWhoa (was:Speaking as a techno-nerd male ...)
Your in a meeting for a reason? Hahaha, oh how naive! If only that were true, most meetings are completely pointless exercises designed to show you the manager is still alive and in fact in 'control'. i would say at most, that 10% of meetings that happen, should happen. The others are a waste of time.
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Tuesday 29th October 2013 12:53 GMT Tom 13
@big_D 28-Oct2013 12:41
There are business meetings and then there are business meetings. At the first it is acceptable to periodically check your inbox or take a call. At the second it is unacceptable. I am frequently in the first one, almost never the second*. Sales pitch meetings are of the second type. The weekly gathering of the tech staff to review mundane management type things is the first sort. And being a tech who gets notified of emergencies by email and phone, that's the reason it is ok for me to check. If the world is coming to and end for one or more of the users I support, it is then appropriate for me to excuse myself to deal with the issue.
*In my work career of more than 15 years since such devices have been commonly available I'd count 3 RIF meetings and 2 Furlough/shutdown meetings for the second category. Nobody is damn fool enough to take me to a sales meeting. I tell the truth too much.
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Monday 28th October 2013 06:22 GMT Steven Roper
Well, I'm male, and I find any phone/gadget use during meetings and presentations unacceptable.
To the point where, if I'm giving a presentation, and someone is using a phone or tablet, I will stop the presentation, explain to everyone present that when we are all ready to continue, I will do so at their earliest convenience; and I will wait until anyone messing about with their gadgets has returned their attention to the meeting.
I've interviewed job candidates who have actually pulled out their phones and started texting, right there in front of me. Needless to say, I've politely informed them at that point that they won't be considered for the position, and they would save their own time and mine by departing forthwith.
I also refuse to hold conversations with people who keep diverting their attention to their phone. I generally give them three warnings, after that I will simply leave, ignore them, or go about my own business, even if they try to pick it up again when they're done.
It's basic human courtesy that when someone is talking to you, you pay attention to them.
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Monday 28th October 2013 08:18 GMT Greg J Preece
To the point where, if I'm giving a presentation, and someone is using a phone or tablet, I will stop the presentation, explain to everyone present that when we are all ready to continue, I will do so at their earliest convenience; and I will wait until anyone messing about with their gadgets has returned their attention to the meeting.
Man, I bet you're a riot at parties.
I also refuse to hold conversations with people who keep diverting their attention to their phone. I generally give them three warnings, after that I will simply leave, ignore them, or go about my own business, even if they try to pick it up again when they're done.
If you were ever so patronising to do that with me, I think I would pull out three different gadgets to get you to leave more quickly. I'm more than capable of listening to someone and simultaneously investigating whether the incoming alert on my phone is just another friend blathering on Facebook or something more important than you that demands my attention. And yes, it quite possible in my line of work that an alert on my phone is more important than whatever you're banging on about, in which case I'd save you the trouble of bemoaning connectivity and leave the conversation first.
If you need someone to lock their gaze on your steely visage at all times whenever you're speaking to avoid being offended, perhaps the problem isn't them.
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Monday 28th October 2013 09:45 GMT DavCrav
Re: @Greg J Preece
"[...]And yes, it quite possible in my line of work that an alert on my phone is more important than whatever you're banging on about[...]"
"@Greg J Preece. You are fired. Why? For wasting company time playing with your toy."
I don't know about you, but it read to me like it is a company mobile and he's getting company-based alerts. I think he'd be fired for ignoring them, rather than answering them, but that's just me and my strange ideas of reading what people actually wrote before commenting.
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Monday 28th October 2013 13:35 GMT PJI
Re: @Greg J Preece
>>I think he'd be fired for ignoring them
I grant that the person may be on pikett duty and so be liable to emergency calls, or he may be awaiting a really important call from a customer or some poor field engineer on site, who is fending off a customer with a problem. But in such cases, it is easy to warn the meeting that you may have to leave urgently, keep your mobile on vibrate and silent and, should it ring, leave the room discretely to answer it (having made sure you are near the door and know how to open it).
In an interview, for either party, there is no excuse for keeping your mobile on. At a meal, see above and never, ever, put your precious on the table.
If you are the speaker or presenter, your audience should have your full, uninterrupted attention. If you can not arrange your time accordingly, you are in the wrong job.
Getting or making calls or messages is not a sign of your importance, cleverness or indispensability.
Finally, nobody is that important.
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Monday 28th October 2013 16:46 GMT Greg J Preece
Re: @Greg J Preece
I don't know about you, but it read to me like it is a company mobile and he's getting company-based alerts. I think he'd be fired for ignoring them, rather than answering them, but that's just me and my strange ideas of reading what people actually wrote before commenting.
You are correct, have an upvote. Checking the alerts on my phone to see if a server just keeled over is not "playing with my toy", especially given that it's a toy the company bought me for that exact purpose. Not sure the rest of you get how priorities work when you're a developer/admin.
As for the implied threat of "long memory", given that I posted with my real name, I hope that future employers do read this and understand that I have the required dedication to my role, which is partly to keep everything working.
I give presentations too, you know.
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Monday 28th October 2013 17:00 GMT Anonymous Coward
Re: @Greg J Preece
> You are correct, have an upvote. Checking the alerts on my phone to see if a server just keeled over is not "playing with my toy", especially given that it's a toy the company bought me for that exact purpose. Not sure the rest of you get how priorities work when you're a developer/admin.
The vast, vast majority of people in meetings are not these types of people.
In any case, If you are an operator responsible for machines and your system is *that* flaky that you need to be checking a mobile phone every minute or two, then might I suggest you have some serious problems?
> I give presentations too, you know.
And if you have something worth listening to, I hope you don't find yourself giving it to a room full of school children with the attention span of a few seconds.
The right comment from someone above suggests that if there is an emergency worthwhile grabbing you out of a meeting, someone will come and get you and everyone else will understand.
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Monday 28th October 2013 20:21 GMT Greg J Preece
Re: @Greg J Preece
In any case, If you are an operator responsible for machines and your system is *that* flaky that you need to be checking a mobile phone every minute or two, then might I suggest you have some serious problems?
Now what part of what I've said at any point implies that I'm constantly checking my phone? Alerts aren't something I generate - they come in when necessary. We have a whole bunch of servers hooked up to the same alerting system, some far more critical than others (including development servers that temporarily scream murder every time someone deploys a new test image). Unfortunately, the mobile client I use only lets me have one ringtone for each alert type, not each machine, and on vibrate it's all the same, so when that thing rings you can bet your wages I'm checking it.
Alerts are just an example I was using of how not all mobile phone use is talking to friends on the Twatters or idly playing games. That might be what the OP uses his phone for, but smartphones were originally invented for other uses.
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Monday 28th October 2013 09:11 GMT Charlie Clark
@Greg - you can't, you only think you can. There are a very, very few number of people in the world who can do multiple cognitive tasks at once, you are most likely not one of them. And, even if you are, your fiddling is almost certainly distracting people around you who might not be quite so, er, "gifted" as yourself.
The police have been investigating the affect of technical distractions such as using the phone on drivers: it seems to affect reaction time in a similar way to alcohol, texting is even worse.
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Monday 28th October 2013 10:26 GMT keithpeter
"I'm more than capable of listening to someone and simultaneously..."
No you are not. You may think you are but each properly designed experiment on attention has suggested otherwise.
Especially when the inputs are delivered via different sense modes.
Try Googling John Sweller's work if you want some full on academic reading.
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Monday 28th October 2013 10:35 GMT Anonymous Coward
"I'm more than capable of listening to someone and simultaneously investigating whether the incoming alert on my phone is just another friend blathering on Facebook or something more important than you that demands my attention."
Yeah, people that do that sort of crap always think they're capable of "multi-tasking". And then it turns out that they're not and everyone has to repeat themselves for the benefit of Mr ADD in the corner. Generally, it's easier and more productive to just fire them and get someone in who can focus on what's going on.
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Monday 28th October 2013 21:26 GMT Anonymous Coward
No manners
Greg J Preece sounds like the sort of pig-ignorant person that this article is featuring. Obviously never been brought up to have some kind of good manners and quite obviously unable to interact and give other people undivided attention. I used to be in the electronics retail business and if someone came into the shop jabbering on a phone, we would just ignore him/her until such time as the person concerned realised that they were just being plain rude. Mobile phones have got a lot to answer for. There is hardly anything that is THAT important that it can't wait until a more convenient time. If I go out socialising, my phone gets switched off and stays in the car. It's high time that restaurants and the like banned customers for using them and disturbing other folk who just want a quiet meal. Likewise the stupid habit of photographing food and sending the results to all and sundry. Crackpots I call them.
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Tuesday 29th October 2013 09:52 GMT Anonymous Coward
@Greg J Preece
Interestingly, there are a lot of downvotes on yours and other posts like them.
Yet the author of the original post clearly has a very high opinion of himself. He expects everybody to pay full attention to his presentations. He expects to punish every body else for the sins of one person by holding up the meeting and wasting their time. It is obvious from his post that he always regards himself as the most important person in the room. And the downvotes are going to posts which suggest, in effect, that the person who thinks he is so important may not be.
Strangely, in meetings in the past, it was not considered rude to refer to printed notes while the presenter was speaking. But it is considered rude to refer to a tablet or phone. What is the difference?
My suspicion is this: that referring to the printed notes keeps you in the data set of the presenter. But referring to your tablet might mean that you are looking at a page which references what the presenter is saying and says something like "This point of view, while once very popular, has now been comprehensively discredited."
In short, it is about power and control. Which is why Obama and Merkel can answer their phones whenever they feel like it.
Don't get me wrong; texting while being interviewed is obviously stupid. But a lot of complaints in other areas basically translate as "I'm important. How can you not be giving me your full attention".
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Tuesday 29th October 2013 12:04 GMT Intractable Potsherd
Re: @Greg J Preece
Why are you at a meeting/presentation so boring that playing with your shiny-shiny is necessary?
If the meeting/presentation is worth your time, put the toys away unless you are on call/have an ongoing genuine emergency situation that can't be directed to someone else, in which case let the chair/presenter know beforehand, and take any calls/emails discretely. Remember that it isn't much more than a decade since people in general had to wait to find things out, and hardly ever were there serious consequences.
If it isn't worth your time, don't go. There are few meetings/presentations that are soooooo vital that your presence is required. If you are so paranoid that you think decisions will be made without you, then pay attention. Poorly attended meetings/presentations send their own message to the people organising them, and things improve (eventually).
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Thursday 31st October 2013 18:33 GMT Greg J Preece
Re: @Greg J Preece
Greg J Preece sounds like the sort of pig-ignorant person that this article is featuring. Obviously never been brought up to have some kind of good manners and quite obviously unable to interact and give other people undivided attention.
Obviously. Yep, from three posts that you clearly didn't read properly, you've got my entire personality nailed.
Why are you at a meeting/presentation so boring that playing with your shiny-shiny is necessary?
Christ's sake, can at least 10% of you at least attempt to read a post properly before leaping onto high horses.
If the meeting/presentation is worth your time, put the toys away unless you are on call
Which I am. And you'd know that if you'd read my posts.
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Monday 28th October 2013 09:23 GMT Alan_Peery
Unwarranted assumptions
> To the point where, if I'm giving a presentation, and someone is using a phone or tablet,
> I will stop the presentation, explain to everyone present that when we are all ready to
> continue, I will do so at their earliest convenience; and I will wait until anyone
> messing about with their gadgets has returned their attention to the meeting.
In doing this, you've made a number of assumptions:
0) That they aren't noting down an otherwise distracting thought that will keep them from paying attention later.
1) That they don't already know the details of what you are saying, or the details behind that.
2) That each part of the content being delivered is relevant for them, in what they need to do for the business.
3) That they can't follow your line of logic, and get to the conclusion more quickly than your slides.
4) That they haven't recognized the balderdash you're serving as coming directly from a Gartner report without taking into account local requirements.
5) That they are not aware of political considerations at work that mean your presentation is irrelevant even though you don't know it yet.
6) That they haven't spotted a logical flaw in your presentation that means the approach will not work.
For the last three cases that person intelligence that might help you, and you have guaranteed that they will not share that with you. You've also completely interrupted the others who had been focused, which shows a great disregard for the mass of your audience.
> It's basic human courtesy that when someone is talking to you, you pay attention to them.
I don't thinking "talking" is what you have in mind. Talking implies a bi-directional exchange. I think you meant speaking, directing, exhorting, or admonishing.
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Monday 28th October 2013 11:49 GMT davenewman
Re: Unwarranted assumptions
Add to that, you are assuming that people are not taking notes on a tablet, because they have given up using old-fashioned paper, as they actually want to be able to search and read those notes later.
At Manchester Medical School, every fourth year student was given an iPad to use as they went out to hospitals. They found the devices ideal for keeping track of everything they did and learned in consultations, recording their performance and elsewhere. It became the repository for all the knowledge they created.
So anyone banning the use of tablets at a business meeting is sabotaging the business, preventing the capture and accumulation of the knowledge generated during the meeting.
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